Feedback Required Alpha 10: New Base Attack (Survival)

Discussion in 'Experimental Features Discussion' started by Hummel-o-War, May 14, 2019 at 4:27 AM.

  1. Hummel-o-War

    Hummel-o-War Administrator
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    OVERVIEW
    Previously, only Drones would attack your base, given some arbitrary rules, like activating the first generator or placing a turret. Starting with Alpha 10, the rules that lead up to a base attack, are much more granular and fully tied to the NPC Faction system. Long story short: For Alpha 10, the Zirax will attack you with drones AND ground troops, if you manage to pi** them off too much.

    This basically means: building a big fat base right in front of their noses and rising the hostility, will most likely trigger an appropriate response. And you better make sure your defenses are up and running, because the drones got more punch and the troopers will not only be able to blast through your walls, but will also attempt to capture your base with their remote hacking devices.

    Because we wanted you to not wonder why exactly an attack happened right now, we added a new INFO in the STATISTIC screen. If your threat level rises above a certain percentage your base will see a Zirax assault team forcefully knocking at your doors.

    _Please note_
    While you can be hostile with Polaris and Talon, both factions do not have a base attack yet. While the Talon attack has already seen some dev time, the Polaris will be added in one of the next major iteration of the base attack module.
     
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  2. nexus_absolute

    nexus_absolute Captain

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    Sorry, not tested yet as at work but I have a couple of questions.

    Q: what happens if you spawn a base with the core buried? Will the attackers attempt to reach it but fail to path-find and just get as close as they can or will they attack the ground in an attempt to reach it?

    Q: what happens if a core is held at the top of a tower without any ground floor access? Will the attackers just keep targeting devices/blocks until the tower collapses (subsequently destroying the core) or will they attempt to path-find as close as they can get and stop?

    In both cases, if attackers attempt to path-find and then just stop I can foresee some exploits where we can funnel attackers and farm them for loot by trapping them first.

    Q: will an attacking force attempt to destroy a shield generator if one is active, before attempting to remove a core or will they hammer-away until the shield is depleted?

    Very excited about base attacks!
    Thanks
     
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  3. Fossil

    Fossil Ensign

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    I really hope for the sake of realism that the remote hacking device can't penetrate shields.
     
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  4. Ashbane

    Ashbane Ensign

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    When your shields are up, the attacking soldiers get "stuck" at the first door to the core since they can't damage the blocks.
    This in turn triggers the rest of the soldiers to start hacking at the core immediately.
    Is this intended? It takes 10 soldiers ~6s to "hack" the core. Once hacked, the shields stay on => will take you forever to retake the base on foot.

    Also, if they spawn in the water (which did happen), they immediately start hacking. And you can't even shoot them in the water (there are ways, but none of them fast enough to actually make a difference).

    Suggestion: they should probably "hack" (turn off) the Shield Generator first and only then go after the core!

    Based on testing - if they can't get to the core, they start using the "hacking" tool to damage your core (it seems to have infinite range) => IMHO not a good idea to bury your core.
    The shield generator is also protected by the shield.
     
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    Last edited: May 14, 2019 at 2:58 PM
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  5. EstebanLB01

    EstebanLB01 Lieutenant

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    Haven't tested yet how it looks, but the Remote Hacking think should be done by a special unit, not a Zirax nerd with a laptop but some low HP light armored ground hover vehicle (operated by said Zirax nerd inside, of course) that stays at a safe distance from the base border or the Core (the latter is easily exploitable sadly), it could be guarded too by normal troops, while the rest of the assault force approaches the base walls.

    On another topic, should the assault force retreat if they suffer enough losses?
     
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  6. Welderold

    Welderold Ensign

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    I just got litle starter base ready and first ziracks wawe comes. It was childsplay. They are level 1 or something. Second was terrible. Several level 10 rocket zirax and I have pistol, rifle and shotgun. I'm level 8, Helou.... litle balance, please :)
     
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  7. Hummel-o-War

    Hummel-o-War Administrator
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    The distant-hacking is intentional. This is also a kind of a failsave and a counter for builds that try to actively hide the core out of reach. ;) in a fee-Block-building game we need something like this I am afraid.

    Note: the zirax will otherwise use all their pathing skills to reach the core physically.

    The frequency of the zirax using that failsave should drop as we ramp up their pathing and Ai skills
     
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  8. zztong

    zztong Rear Admiral

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    I'll have to see it in play, but my initial reaction is that I'm not fond of a base being remotely hacked. I get that it is an attempt to make sure that base design doesn't take advantage of game limitations make an invulnerable base. I don't like the notion that a well-designed base can just be captured without the base having been pounded into submission and/or run out of ammo.
     
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  9. Dawg

    Dawg Ensign

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    I am with you and I started a thread in Bug report with a copy of a legit base that they hack instead of going to the core. Seems so far if the core is not level with the ground then they just hack. Though they did go under the base as it was on stilts meant for water placement. They went to under the core and then just hacked away. I would suggest if you find another build with similar issue bring it to that thread or create another. More info we flood them with the faster they can work it all out.
     
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  10. zztong

    zztong Rear Admiral

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    I suppose the nature of my first impression is that it feels like you cannot defend against being hacked. Maybe there's more to the story. Maybe they have to get next to the base? Maybe they have to get inside the perimeter of the base? maybe they can't hack a base if the WiFi blocks are powered off? If they just have to be in the region for some amount of time and the base flips, then it just feels like they magically owned me.

    I won't get a chance to experience anything myself until at least tomorrow. :(
     
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  11. Evolvei

    Evolvei Commander

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    Some players use CVs as a base. Eventually are the attacks going to be against CVs that land on planet?
     
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  12. SceptreX42

    SceptreX42 Lieutenant

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    If you take over another base or add a core to a wreckage POI, will it be attacked, or is this just for bases you've built?
     
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  13. banksman45

    banksman45 Rear Admiral

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    My first impressions is I like it. I would not mind seeing the first Zirax unit be a little harder because this is suppose to be a full scale Raid on your base. I love the idea of Hacking, which isn't magical, it's REAL LIFE. Welcome to 21st century WARFARE people. Your enemy can take over your base while you're still in it. You want realism well this is how it works in the real world. You have just pissed off a whole entire faction on this planet and they have pretty much declared war on you. So they are going to send their best warriors to get rid of you. Just like in real life if a Country views you as a terrorist, they're not going to send some Rookies after you. They're going to send a Special Forces Military unit after you and they're not going to ask you if their means of attack was "balanced" they are going to bring the PAIN and it's up to you to figure out how to survive it. I don't think many changes should be made to the base attack besides making even harder than what it is. Base attack is pretty much WAR, if you're not ready for War then don't piss off the any of the factions on this planet. It's as simple as that.
     
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  14. SGP Corp

    SGP Corp Commander

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    @Taelyn said this in another thread:
     
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  15. RazzleWin

    RazzleWin Captain

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    Yes I agree it is like real life in one way. But then shouldn't we be able to provide a scrambling device to stop them from hacking it?:D I think I would prefer the option to force their way, all the way to the core like we have to.:rolleyes: Or give us a remote hacking device so we can do the same to their bases it's only fair.:cool:
     
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  16. Temcai

    Temcai Ensign

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    I just noticed the update, so maybe this is already in there, but can we hack their base remotely? We should be able to build the same tools as they can for raiding Zirax bases, in my opinion, anyways.
     
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  17. Sgt. DoomForge

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    Agreed. If they are able to use those tools to cheat the player out of their bases, we should be able to have a way to prevent it too.

    Edit: On the topic of shields in relation to base defenses, will there be a chance of additional emitter blocks or something that can expand the shield from a source building to other nearby grids in a set radius? That could add an interesting mechanic as well as allow more efficient use of materials while still being able to keep bases covered.
     
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    Last edited: May 15, 2019 at 1:26 AM
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  18. Ashbane

    Ashbane Ensign

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    Can you make it so that only a single soldier in the squad can hack the core at the same time? Because with more soldiers, it takes them a few seconds to replace the core (which barely gives you time to react in situations where they get "stuck").

    Can you also make it so that they will hack the Shield Generator first (and disable it for some time - so it can't be turned on) and then go for the core? This will avoid base retake issues.
     
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  19. Space Beagle

    Space Beagle Captain

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    I wanted to make this same suggestion last night (and before when Eleon first introduced new 'zirax in offense' tactic) about 'specialist' in Zirax platoon, just like we have 'commander' and troopers with different weapons - so lets have also "Engineers" with block-cutting tool and "ECM specialist" with electronic kit for powering down shields & hacking cores (ECM is 'electronic countermeasures', and sounds to me kinda OK as example). Mixed platoon from one dropship of 6-8 Zirax paratroopers could still make real damage but will look & feel better and will give realistic chance for defence (and not some frantic chase when everyone have hacking/cutting ability), and later with our bigger bases and massive attack of 3-4 dropships it will be like a real war ;)

    We all know that more refinement and balance is coming with feedback and new additions, but people also should change their game style a little bit - same as we are attacking & terrorizing poor Zirax all the time, it is OK now for them to finally fight back Earth scum :D
    Change your tactics if you want to build a big base in their way, make your bases more 'fortressy', have some pillboxes, trenches, build some small & cheap defensive HV and park them to guard your perimeter, etc. ... or just build your base where they cant reach you :p
     
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  20. banksman45

    banksman45 Rear Admiral

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    I think the scrambling device would be pretty cool if it was own mini game. Where the Zirax are trying to hack your system and you are having to continue to tap a button to keep scrambling the signal.
     
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