Alpha 6.7: Signal Logic Update, Hull Textures and "Road to Alpha 7"

Discussion in 'Patch Notes' started by EleonGameStudios, Aug 24, 2017.

  1. Hummel-o-War

    Hummel-o-War Administrator
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    It is still in the tool.
     
    #61
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  2. banksman45

    banksman45 Rear Admiral

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    Wow Really ???? So Empyrion is going to be a mixture of fixed and procedural planets? That will make for some interesting Star systems to visit and explore!!
     
    #62
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  3. Hummel-o-War

    Hummel-o-War Administrator
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    Yes, really. As we wrote in the blog, the terrain is the same, only the creation differs. In the end, we will have two methods in one game and the playfield.yaml decides which one is called. This why it is not a problem to have both handmade and procedural planets in the same savegame (of course not on the same playfield ;-)
     
    #63
  4. Hummel-o-War

    Hummel-o-War Administrator
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    Correct. Playfields are generated "by chunk".

    Now, as we wrote above, the procedural terrain is running through the "modules". So in this case, if you fly into a new chunk, the terrain is computed again via the modules (as there is no other reference OTHER than the advices saved in the modules), based on the SEED. So for a specific seed, the terrain is of course identical on position xyz, but it is not "saved" to a map or position, but calculated via the module every time. So there is no performance gain form having explored the whole map, as a chunk unloads when you leave it. Only terrain changes are saved

    Thats why the handmade planets do need a lot LESS performance (or equal amounts while having a higher detail grade at the same time): if you are at position XYZ the PC does not need to CALCULATE the terrain, it just grabs the info from the heightmap (as this map is FIXED)
     
    #64
  5. rucky

    rucky Captain

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    Nope.
    Sorry but you're simply wrong.

    Proof: Counter-Examples.

    Example 1: My CV, in Empyrion 6.5 it was CLASS 5, now CLASS 4
    http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=972240668
    (pics already updated)

    Example 2: My SV, was CLASS 2, now CLASS 1
    http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=970507316
    (pics not updated, showing class 2, download it, check it, it's now class 1)
    another SV:
    http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1109737831

    It's a bit more difficult to say, what really is nerfed.
    Definitively NOT Devices (RCS, Thruster, Weapons, Fuel Tanks and all the other things you listed, besides standard building blocks), but these Buildings blocks and special Shapes from/with them got nerfed (wrong word, but I take yours), because the formula now weightens that more then before!
     
    #65
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2017
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  6. malrose1

    malrose1 Lieutenant

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    If "mountain" height is adjusted to 500m... will drones have the ability to climb that high..?
     
    #66
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  7. banksman45

    banksman45 Rear Admiral

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    So could handmade planets lead to Alien faction or friendly NPC homeworlds with cities on them ? Maybe Overseer homeworld ? Since the performance hits will be less.
     
    #67
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  8. Hummel-o-War

    Hummel-o-War Administrator
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    Good question, so why not - lets assume this would be technically feasible:

    Short Answer: No. The performance gain of handcrafted terrain is not that the full map is always present, it is because the game only needs to "look up" the numbers instead of computing the whole terrain info. This way the game can spend "more performance" for the detail quality.

    Long answer: There is a reason most (if not all) games with voxel terrain us the "chunk method" nowadays.

    1. Saving a heightmap and a texturemap is not just a press of a button or like saving a savegame in a second. It takes quite some time. For me creating a heightmap (i5 6600K + GF1070 + 16GB RAM) in the editor takes about 15-30seconds - if i do no use too many "extras". And this would need to be done for EACH planet in your game, either when you start it (Amount of playfiels * 15 sec) or when you approach it .
    So you either have a "loading time" each time you enter a planet (bad)..or you have a lot of "loading time" at the game start (even worse)...think of the 50, 100, 200 and more planet scenarios :D

    2. We edit heightmaps and texturemaps .. like a "post-processing"...which saves roughly up to 50% of filesize. So you would not only WAIT forever for your game to start while the game is trying to save the heightmaps, this process would also fill up your RAM and HDD in no time...
     
    #68
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  9. Hummel-o-War

    Hummel-o-War Administrator
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    Theoretically yes, as you could place POIs on the spot (fixed position). This currently works already (since a few updates ago, eg. using a fixed position and random positions side by side in procedural terrain), but this of course only works out, if you also use a fixed seed....or the former flat area might be a mountainside in the other seed :D

    With handmade planets this would be easier, as you can always see the terrain you are working with and thus placing the POIs on the position where you want and not need to take into account other SEEDs.
     
    #69
  10. Israel

    Israel Ensign

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    First off you didn't read correctly i already admitted i was probably wrong about the triangle thing. Enough said no need to add nothing of meaning like you just have in that subject.

    Second i never said the device count got changed. I was talking about pyramids and thats it and in that regard if you use only pyramids like i do on my ships all of the above devices get even more limited with this new update period. So this means that you are wrong. :]
     
    #70
  11. oojimaflip

    oojimaflip Captain

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    #71
  12. rucky

    rucky Captain

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    Perhaps use other blocks instead?
    You're saying Devices get even more limited.
    Why that? Only because you want/need/whatever use some amount of pyramids and don't want to use other block types or use less?

    Pyramids are weighened now MORE than before - what is a good thing btw - so now you have to weighten yourself:
    Do you still want to use them (for whatever reason still applies to you)?
    Then you have so sacrifies something else.

    But it's NOT the Devices get limited "even more" in this update. (That's simply WRONG.)
    It's your special design that define what's going into it!
    You want more Devices? Then take less Pyramids. Or change your Design. Simple as that.
    So, no, I'm not wrong.
     
    #72
  13. Space Beagle

    Space Beagle Captain

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    This is a HUGE thing, meaning of this is that (in some future) our Galaxy could be like 'real one' - lots & lots of star systems, each with couple of (randomly picked from games stock base) detailed & prepared handmade planets accompanied with 4-6 much simpler but procedurally generated planets and moons... and all of that multiply by like 500 :D
     
    #73
  14. binhthuy71

    binhthuy71 Captain

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    If everything ws nerfed then nothing was nerfed. No one lost anything.
     
    #74
  15. Israel

    Israel Ensign

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    Did you not get the memo? xD I'v never said devices got limited. If i did can you quote me saying that? Thanks.

    Anyways i'v already made my ship class one again. I just added more square blocks and removed a good amount of pyramids. :]

    I'll even show you a picture of my beautiful ship. Caution in order to see this ship, dark 3d sunglasses are required so its magnificence doesn't blind your mire mortal eyes. xD...
     

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  16. rucky

    rucky Captain

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    oh my... just read your own text, when this is too much for you then okay...

    Hint:

    but as me and others hinted, change your design, and you've done that now, so anything should be okay then again, right?
     
    #76
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2017
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  17. Israel

    Israel Ensign

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    You took that out of context hahaha man your bad at trolling xD

    Heres the passage were you took those few words from: Second i never said the device count got changed. I was talking about pyramids and thats it and in that regard if you use only pyramids like i do on my ships all of the above devices get even more limited with this new update period. So this means that you are wrong. :]

    You got anything else thats false to say? Or did you get enough of a whopping for now?
     
    #77
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  18. rucky

    rucky Captain

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    you said:
    1) if you use only pyramids like i do on my ships...
    2) all of the above devices get even more limited with this new update

    this is WRONG. WHY CAN'T YOU GET THAT?!
    With Pyramids, without them it, doesn't matter, because the Devices are not limited in no sense.
    It's only your own design.

    And you've proven that yourself now, as you obvious got your design changed. Did you?!
    So who's the troll now?

    But I stop now talking with you. Grow up.
     
    #78
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  19. Israel

    Israel Ensign

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    What part of this passage do you not get? "Second i never said the device count got changed. I was talking about pyramids and thats it and in that regard if you use only pyramids like i do on my ships all of the above devices get even more limited with this new update period. So this means that you are wrong. :]"

    I never said the devices got limited in them by themselfs. I was talking about pyramids and in relation to that i said "all of the above devices got even more limited". And that was in relation to using an "all pyramid ship" and this ship is specifically "my ship." That is the truth you can twisted anyway you like but the truth stays the truth. Deal with it and you grow up. :]
     
    #79
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2017
  20. Vuelhering

    Vuelhering Ensign

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    Oh my, a beholder!

    • In any case, This update caused my furnace to lose all its templates!

    I'm certain I saw them last night, but they be gone.
     
    #80
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