Alpha 8.0 EXP: New food and food-item drop system

Discussion in 'Experimental Features Discussion' started by Hummel-o-War, Apr 19, 2018.

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  1. Hummel-o-War

    Hummel-o-War Administrator
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    We changed the single-purpose food & item drops system into a basic set of groups.

    - PlantProtein
    - NaturalSweetener
    - Grain
    - Berries
    - Fruit
    - Mushroom
    - NaturalStimulant
    - Vegetables
    - Spice
    - Buds

    Each harvestable plant in the game, that is relevant to a food item or meal, will drop an item that is named like one of these groups. For example: Corn and Wheat plants will get you GRAIN.

    There are other plants, that did not see a change yet, like Varon Root still drops Varon Roots, but this might change as we explore categories and new food groups in the future! We are of course open to any suggestions on that matter. ;)

    3b. Alternative ingredient crafting
    In addition to these first set of groups (might be expanded in the future as we add more plants and planets!) we still have a few collectibles

    - Egg
    - Milk
    - Meat

    There is a slight change as well - or better: new alternatives. Having those is often a key, for example if you are in desperate need of a collectible and you simply cannot find it or you ran out of ammo in the c(h)ase for meat.

    Whatever the reason is, we thought it is a good idea, to add a few test cases in Alpha 8, like being able to craft Meat and Milk from PlantProtein, Vegetables (Starch!) and Water. Pretty much like it is done already today in the real world. Of course this is the 25th century way doing it. There are a few more recipes added like this (like PlantProtein can be extracted also from Vegetables, etc).

    Eggs are the only exception from this new rule, as there is no logic replacement for them yet. As an alternative to hunting the dinos, we added little nests you can pick up the eggs from.

    As a side effect, we now can officially claim that you can fill your food bar without having to HARM A SINGLE ANIMAL in the game. :D

    Final word on the new food and drop groups: Bear with us that we do not reveal all the recipes yet, as they might still change, but as we said, you can now also SELF-GROW ALL of the ingredients you need for any food item in your growing plots!

    We also made sure the categories are that flexible, so we can have all the ingredients dropping from wild plants - at least for the starter worlds. The plants dropping for example BERRIES of course might be different on a temperate world compared to an icy or desert world.

    Full overview of the ingredients, currently needed to craft all the new food AND medical templates:

    FoodGroups_finalEXP1.jpg
     
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    Last edited: Apr 23, 2018
  2. Hummel-o-War

    Hummel-o-War Administrator
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    Notes:
    - All stats (health, food, stamina, perish) are calculated based on their ingredients!
    - The crafting time is now calculated based on the total beneficial stats of an item. Example: High healt+low stamina is created slower than low health+low stamina.
     
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  3. Hummel-o-War

    Hummel-o-War Administrator
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    New FOOD Templates
    • Fruit Juice
    • Vegetable Juice
    • Berry Juice
    • Power Bar (using Plant Protein)
    • Hot Beverage (using Buds)
    • Fried Vegetables
    Renamed FOOD Templates
    • KavaeCoffee > Energy Drink
    • Popcorn > Cereals
    Main Drops: FOOD
    • Plant Protein: Corndogs, Corndogs Snow, Ahax Fruit, Seaweed, Big Flower
    • Grain: Wheat, Corn
    • Berries: Akua Berries
    • Vegetables: Pumpkin, Bulbshroom, Space Durians, Egg Plant, Tomato
    • Fruit: Pearthing, Space Oranges
    • Spice: Cobra Leaves plant
    • Natural Sweetener: Alien Worm plant
    • Herbal Leaves: Pixie Stalks plant, Aloe Vera plant
    • Natural Stimulant: Kavae Plant, BrainFungus/BrainFungusSnow, PulpitFungus
    • Mushrooms: Mushroom2, MushroomBellBrown01, MushroomTallGreen01
    • Buds: AlienPlant07 (Blue flower plant with spiky leaves)
    Additional Drops: MEDICAL*
    • HerbalLeaves: PixieStalks Plant & PixieStalks Snow Aloe Vera Plant
    • ConfettiMossScrapings: ConfettiMoss, DimpleDome, DimpleDomeSnow
    • FireMossScrapings: ClusterShroom
    • AlienTooth: (dropped from creatures)
    • AlienParts02: (dropped from creatures)
    • AlienParts01: AlienPlantReef2, CoralBig01
    • AlienParts03: AlienPlantPod2, CoralBig08
    • AlienThorn: OpuntiaCactus, AlienPlantThorn2, Cactus1
    * Some FOOD items are also used for medical items (like Natural Stimulant, Mushrooms, etc)

    For some plant names, use this reference (needs to be updated, but still is up to date with the internal plant names) > Playfield Reference Sheet v1
    https://empyriononline.com/threads/handbook-playfield-reference-sheet-v0-1.12646/
     
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    Last edited: May 30, 2018
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  4. Hummel-o-War

    Hummel-o-War Administrator
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    KNOWN ISSUES:

    - .. -
     
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  5. JuStX2

    JuStX2 Captain

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    No never-spoiling bacon? What a let down :/

    Also not entirely sure you should've renamed "Popcorn" - after all it's not cereal - it's buttery.
     
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  6. WolfEyes

    WolfEyes Captain

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    Corn is a grain which is used to make cereals. And not everyone likes butter on their popcorn. At least, not the heavily drowned, fattening theater buttered popcorn. Not to mention having to carry wet wipes to clean all the grease off your hands with. :p

    Oh and when did we get bacon in the game? I want some! Naow!

    [​IMG]
     
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  7. JShark13

    JShark13 Ensign

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    Wait, so why is textured plant protein not counted as, well, plant protein? Why is it a vegetable, while the Ahax FRUIT is counted as plant protein?

    EDIT: Also, I'd consider making Aloe Vera (which is still in game, but I don't know if it still generates naturally) a type of Herbal Leaves, as well as add some kind of grow-able source of Alien Thorn, Confetti Moss Scrapings and Fire Moss Scrapings.
     
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    Last edited: Apr 24, 2018
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  8. JuStX2

    JuStX2 Captain

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    Nice but i'm literally dying for some meat - like hunt-able early game mobs are MUCH less common :p
     
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  9. Takuwind

    Takuwind Lieutenant

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    Ok I guess this is the feedback thread for food?

    So my feedback is that getting food in the Alpha 8.0.0 game is WAAAY too hard. Why?
    • Because I have all my settings to maximum easy mode.
    • I am picking up EVERY SINGLE plant item I see.
    • I am ONLY looking for plants
    • I am sprinting as much as possible
    • I generally can get 1 to 3 food bars by nightfall
    • I always die of starvation just about the time the sun has set
    So I could understand this being the case on HARD mode, but if you have settings for Easy, then a casual player should be able to survive. As you can see above, there is nothing casual about my approach. I am going full-bore max-food and still cannot survive.
     
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  10. Javarox87

    Javarox87 Commander

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    At first it was very hard to figure out how not to starve to death. I starved 12 times before getting a garden going. The garden only prolonged the inevitable. I did eventually get my HV going and a T2 assault... but I find myself hunting/gathering constantly leaving little time to actually collect resources, explore, and travel the distances in order to complete missions. The food system is great, but I feel the values are too low on the crafted food items. An increase of 20-30% would be fine to prevent the games focus on being “eat, hunt, eat, grow, eat, starve, respawn, gather, eat”
     
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  11. Scoob

    Scoob Rear Admiral

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    Interestingly, I've not had a problem with Food, despite foolishly sprinting everywhere early-game.

    In my wandering I have, oddly, encountered lots of plants that are already harvested which I thought was strange, as well as frustrating when I needed just one more Plant Protein to craft a bar.

    While food isn't a problem, I've not found any Grains (Corn, Wheat) or Herbal Leaves (Pixie Stalks) the latter being important for Stomach pills...potentially (highly likely unless they've change something )needed if you eat raw plants. I've explored, I think, all Biome types on the starting planet.

    I do think the food level drops too quickly when certain status effects are applied, being cold early-game (no suit) has a quite extreme effect. Sure, we can make a hot beverage but that requires water, something that cannot be simply collected early-game, you need a deployed - and powered - Water Collector for that.

    Scoob.
     
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  12. Keith Hovey

    Keith Hovey Captain

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    I have had a lot of similar problems too. Though I did find pixie stalks freaking everywhere! Then again I did freeze a lot seeing them.

    A few notes...

    The stamina drain makes playing a chore.

    The temps are definitely off. Freeze too easily, die of heat too easily. I mean it does show i have SOME clothing on when I start. I would think I would be ok in 50f weather.

    Food doesnt offset much because the drains (On easy mind you) just kept me farming constantly. I was never actually able to break away from the stamina issues / Medical issues. They are WAY intense. I feel like even in late game they wouldnt be overcome very easily and would still be a nuisance. Imagine running from one end of a ship / base to another. Eat. Run back. Eat. Fall through the ship on accident. Fight off chain of OMG im dying. Eat. tear down a base. Eat / deconstruct / eat / deconstruct / eat / deconstruct. I can totally see that becoming mid game / late game as it stands.

    Dont get me wrong here though. This update added some complexity that was missing. But it feels like its overcompensating for the lack of mid game / late game content. IMHO. Not sure if that was the intention.
     
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  13. arathorn867

    arathorn867 Commander

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    Don't sprint, stamina uses food and only makes you die faster. The early drops seem to include a bike, get that ASAP.

    Get close to big lakes or oceans when possible. There's abundant sea weed (in my world anyway) and the herbal stalks deal with the indigestion.

    So far I have found a big fat ZERO on vegetables however. I've done several k of exploration and have yet to find it. I think I have every other food group at this point.
     
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  14. Diamaht

    Diamaht Lieutenant

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    I would suggest more meat from animal kills, I killed a trike and got one meat. Most things seem to give only a couple meat when downed. Something the size of a dinosaur should give half a dozen meals at least. That will make the early grind a bit more bearable. They could even drop eggs, females would have them inside just like fish.
     
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  15. TastyChickenLegs

    TastyChickenLegs Commander

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    Started a new game tonight. I began with a drill, ore scanner, and a gun among other things Nice. I like the variety of tools and found the new planets to be beautiful. Overall the food is hard to find. Like really hard to find. The temps were fine with the tent and the sleeping is awesome. I wont say this is a game flaw as much as it maybe my inability to scout better or understand the food recipes but it was a challenge to eat. The stamina is way better than videos I watched earlier in the day. I assume that was improved. Food drain was acceptable but I couldn't find anything to eat.

    Overall the land feels dead. Great plants, amazing biomes, beautiful foliage but otherwise not very immersive. I'm not really sure how to fix that or what I am looking for. I just don't feel like it's real. The butterflies and fireflies are a great touch and definitely go far in making it believable. I think that is the right direction. Animal sounds, birds, or whatever bring the land to life.

    Also I found no ores. I have an ore scanner but nothing. I haven't traveled far because I just started so this could be my starting location.

    I like it. It's huge and I totally appreciate the Devs in working to make this version. This game is still my favorite for sure. I will most definitely have more to add in the coming days
     
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  16. ravien_ff

    ravien_ff Captain

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    There's far less animals compared with 7.x and a huge lack of POIs. I agree with others that it feels too empty at the moment. I hope we get both more animals and more POIs. It's especially important for the starter planet because that will be many new player's first impression of the game and it needs to feel alive.
     
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  17. Kassonnade

    Kassonnade Rear Admiral

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    Even if we had the same number of POIs and animals it would feel less "packed" because of greater distances. That was part of the idea of having bigger planets : to force the player to move around and explore, not just "for a few minutes" but as an habit. Making a huge base and CV might not sound very "survival" if easily available in a few days on the starter planet. We have plenty of tools now to make it whatever we want, but we still have other core features to come (shields, mass to inventory, radars, etc).

    I saw a few bunches of animals but they all ran away when I walked towards them... it's a bit like hunting in real life: wild animals don't tend to just walk around carelessly.

    I saw that we have no "sprouts" yet in the "default" creative menu like we used to have ; we have to type the name in the search bar to get them.
     
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  18. TheRealRonin

    TheRealRonin Lieutenant

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    It's only my opinion but for me the food system is pretty OK. Sure, it's not 7.6 and took me some time to get to it but now I can't complain. In the starter biome, there is plenty of food (the old corn dogs) to collect before you go to the next place. Didn't took my really long to get 20 power bars, even with not picking up every single plant i can see.
    Next stop is the wreckage to get your free bike and constructor. With the bike you can get to some more biomes getting other types of plants. Not every biome has every type of plant, just as explained by the devs. Most biomes on the starter planet are forest like with a lot of "spice" plants which give 45 food of each. The -1 HP is no impact at all.
    When the night comes and it gets cold, go to a warm spot at the starter biome. Also make use of your survival tent.
    It doesn't take long to get your armor and after this, the temps aren't a problem anymore. Also you can set up a farm pretty quick which solves any food problems.

    All games I started are on Hard, with slow progression, high temp impact and few ores. Food consumption is at normal.
     
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  19. Agent0024

    Agent0024 Commander

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    I like the start of the food system that was put forward in 8.0. Having access to a majority of the items needed for food and meds regardless of planet is a very good thing and we are nearly there. The system needs some polish. The tie in of food with stamina is overly aggressive at this stage I feel. The rate at which stamina drains is almost punitive it seems. I died many times over from starving, freezing and so on. I also had many instances where the old Plant Protein pods were empty. It's also worth noting that this gives 1 vegetable when harvested, while the normal vegetables give 4. Perhaps that's intended that our planted crops yield more, I could see that being the case. Animals should definitely give more meat than they do. I shouldn't kill a non-insect animal and get no meat at all, which I've seen happen several times, instead an egg or 2.

    That said, this patch is absolutely amazing!
     
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  20. Space Beagle

    Space Beagle Captain

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    This is obviously first 'simpler' iteration of experimental alpha 8, with a focus on new start, early survival, new environment... so we play now with this things in emptier worlds - and with every 'phase' they will add some new stuff but also unlock & increase more of the 'old stuff'. We will see are they have some serious limitations in 'richness of the world' near the end of Alpha 8 Experimental phases :)

    First we need to get rid of some bigger bugs also, like personal drone or terrain glitches or...
     
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