Alpha 8.7.1: Back to Unity 2017

Discussion in 'Patch Notes' started by EleonGameStudios, Oct 31, 2018.

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  1. JTurbo

    JTurbo Commander

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    Sunday - We would like to hear news about alpha 9... :)
     
    #61
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  2. Kassonnade

    Kassonnade Rear Admiral

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    You seem to care much more about other's feelings towards the game/ developers than towards the game itself, despites the last sentence you wrote in your last message.

    I can point out that for vendors to be successful, they either need to have an excellent product, excellent vendor skills, something of both, or very dumb customers. Since Empyrion has evident defects and a very slow development rate I would take the "excellent product'' out from the equation to make it clear that what you are saying here sounds very fanboy-ish.

    They even changed their forecast from 1 to 2-3 more years on the Steam store page recently. Knowing that in 2017 the page still showed "we expect to be 1 year in Early access" making it actually 1.5 year late on schedule, you can see this adjustment as a vendor act more than any kind of development pronostic. They did the same thing after their initial (failed) Kickstarter venture, telling the eventual buyers the game would be ready at the end of 2015.

    kickstart.jpg

    I can also see how the forum activity is taken into account by the developers to fine tune their 'development''. The forum activity is far from what it used to be just a few months ago (which was already not much to brag about), and even then the active members were just a very tiny fraction of the player base. So what does 'pleasing the community' really means regarding all the other ''customers'' that do not come to these forums to get some info on the game ?

    I suggest to you that the vast majority of customers will simply read reviews and, for the more zealous, they might try to find some "let's play" videos (since the wiki is dead and dry) where objectivity in criticism is far from the norm.

    If you really want to avoid speculating on what happens in the developer's head, I suggest you spend only 1 hour of your life reading through the very first pages of the forum archives. Try it, it will be very instructive. You will find out that most of the "original and fresh ideas" that people post now and that posted then were the same, for the most part. You will also see how the "community" was enthusiastic, and how this enthusiasm slowly faded on an individual basis, after waiting for variable amounts of time per individual and seeing the pace at which the game was developed.

    Frankly, if the developers want to take 5 more years to develop this game at that pace, do you really believe the "community" will grow and get behind them ? Of course, "everything is possible" but this is not very realistic. You may also see that even positive reviews on Steam are not praising the game on many aspects, but just because there is no middle ground between "recommend" and "not recommend" on Steam the simple binary distribution of positive/ negative review is not representative of what the average player might think of the game. In almost every review, it is clearly seen that the game is far from completion. Maybe you could nuance your previous message to show if the developers care equally for all customers, or if they care most for eventual customers ?

    And whatever you can answer to this, it will still be speculative. I suggest that even if a vendor tells us we are the best in the world and he loves us it doesn't make the game better. Electronic Arts, Ubisoft and other big companies often show their customer bases they don't really care about them, they just care about money. I wouldn't go too far from this while speculating about anyone in the gaming business, honestly. It is much easier to write a small apology on a forum than to work on the core of the game.
     
    #62
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2018
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  3. FRAGaLOT

    FRAGaLOT Captain

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    So in an earlier post I was complaining about lag, having issues landing on a planet, and warping while on a multiplayer server.

    Turns out that having grow plot blocks was the culprit that prevented (or severely slowed down) logins in to the server, if the player was to spawn into a playfield with grow plots, or other similar blocks. As well as being able to transition from one playfield to another, Landing on a planet, going into orbit, and warping. If the destination playfield had grow plots, there were problems.

    This includes CVs that had gardens. Another culprit also seems to be the NPC blocks, but not the spanwers, but the dancers, and static people sitting at tables and desks, standing in place, etc.

    On the server I've been playing on we've removed all plant grow blocks and most of the NPC blocks (except dancers on the starting planet Akua) and a lot of issues have been solved.

    But now as a consequence we can't grow any food. :( Which is really bad on some planets (and space) that don't have wildlife to harvest food from.
     
    #63
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2018
  4. Nogitsune

    Nogitsune Rear Admiral

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    To get O2 (aside from emergency generator), water is needed.. and the only way to get water is from lakes. Where there are lakes, there are usually some things to use to get food from too - and food holds forever in fridge as long as ship is powered. I'm not saying "ditch the grow plots", just that I think it's reasonably possible to manage without them - although I imagine it makes some planets a lot more difficult to start on, and makes the end-game more tedious. Meanwhile I think there's two ways to go: either take it as temporary added challenge, or it's possible to adjust something like energy bar formula to be crafted from "alternate ingredients" - even if it doesn't make logical sense. Something like.. water, silicon and iron for example. If server is organized enough to remove grow plots, it shouldn't be any more difficult to alter a food formula in config file.
     
    #64
  5. krazzykid2006

    krazzykid2006 Captain

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    You can also place water generators on snow, it doesn't have to be a lake

    P.s.
    Even on a lava planet there is places you can put a water generator (the hot water/lava).
     
    #65
  6. rebuilthk47

    rebuilthk47 Lieutenant

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    Hey c'mon now. That's just not right. Eleon is not E.A. That's just a cruel comparison. NO game company is as evil as E.A.
     
    #66
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  7. FRAGaLOT

    FRAGaLOT Captain

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    Sorry I'm not going to treat an obvious bug as feature and play around it. We have a lot of food stored up when having a farm wasn't a problem, as to why it's suddenly an issue is anyone's guess. At the moment it's moot since the server I play wont let me login anymore, it just hangs in a forever loop and it won't log me in.. SOMETIMES it tells me that the play field I am in is having problems and everyone in the play field was kicked offline... but it still doesn't fix anything if i wait a couple minutes and try again. It just gets worse and worse.

    This particular server I play on is just completely screwed up and none of my friends can figure out if it's the hosting service they use (sorry I forget which one), or the server software Eleon made is just screwed up... or what. We reboot the server all the time when we see a problem but it doesn't fix anything, so it's not a memory leak. It's just completely FUBAR.

    Also why isn't there away to abort server logins? Why do I have to CTRL-ALT-DEL to open task manager to force quit Empyrion when it's not able to connect to a server?
     
    #67
  8. FRAGaLOT

    FRAGaLOT Captain

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    DSL at it's finest. Causing more problems than it fixes.
     
    #68
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  9. FRAGaLOT

    FRAGaLOT Captain

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    Ditto, it ran fine for me. Because right now on multiplayer, it won't let me login for some stupid reason.
     
    #69
  10. FRAGaLOT

    FRAGaLOT Captain

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    By then unity will be on engine 2021.
     
    #70
  11. FRAGaLOT

    FRAGaLOT Captain

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    I don't think its LoD, but it's the DSL feature that isn't updating it self soon enough. LoD deals with textures and models. DSL deals with the terrain and that's the problem he is having is with the terrain.
     
    #71
  12. Scoob

    Scoob Rear Admiral

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    Yeah, I was using LoD in a very simplified sense and referring to terrain LoD. Basically, how terrain is rendered more simply from a distance and I've seen that "low poly" terrain still be rendered when quite close, then it usually "pops" to the higher poly mesh. It's like the game sometimes gets a little behind, usually this results in more noticeable terrain pop as it occurs a little closer, other times it can fail to load in all together.

    Scoob.
     
    #72
  13. krazzykid2006

    krazzykid2006 Captain

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    DSL (or Dynamic Structure Loading) is only for structures, it's not for the terrain.
     
    #73
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  14. Myrmidon

    Myrmidon Rear Admiral

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    Does anybody know, do we have to recreate a scenario on the SSG for the playfield changes to be in effect or just start a new game?
     
    #74
  15. Arrclyde

    Arrclyde Rear Admiral

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    I don't think it is a comparison in evilness from Kassonades side. More a thought if Eleon might have bit off more than they can chew.

    I still have faith in the developers passion for their game. But i also admit that i ask myself "is this the right way to make a game in early access?"

    All this fiddling around with swapping engines. Yes it might be needed for bigger galaxies and more performance. But when the most basic feature took (and takes, didn't have time to check) ages and nothing happend. How about starting small and expand on that and not trying to go big before the core isn't there. What that could be.... well, can we crouch now in game?
    The technical part is very important. But does the game really need in depth physics for everything? What the game mostly needs in early access is funding. Attract new people. It needs to have a own identity, which is hard when many things in the game (got better already) is mostly from the engines assetstore. Generic style doesn't sell well.
    I know how important tech and gameplay is. And it always will be important for a game success. But that is not what attracts new players. Never underestimate the value of "cool looks", it is what makes people interested in a game. That and the posibilities it offers.

    I just hope the state of the game is good and the future is somehow safe from a financial standpoint. But the progress is a little to slow (my opinion) and focus lies more on tech. Don't get me wrong, but tech and engine as important as they are are not what drives people to a game. Those are the parts people EXPECT to work. But what they want is a cool game, one that also looks cool too.

    I decided to not give up on Eleon and Empyrion. But i probably take a break. Just to wait and see the direction it is going for now. And i hope the game makes leaps meanwhile.
     
    #75
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  16. Damocles

    Damocles Captain

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    A recent surveillance shot of Eleons Headquarter:
    [​IMG]
     
    #76
  17. Cleff

    Cleff Captain

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    Sadly I have a similar feeling about Empyrion as a lot of others do lately on these forums. While the devs are a great team, don't get me wrong, there just hasn't been as much attention given to the "core gameplay features" that a lot of people talk about. It's mostly trivial things or sprinkles on top of the ice cream. But it doesn't work when the ice cream is Brussels sprouts flavored.

    I've been a long time supporter of Eleon and Empyrion, and I'll never turn my back on them, I just haven't cared as much in recent months. I've realized that unless some real game-changing updates roll in, and with some semblance of frequency, I most likely will never "properly" play through the game again. Crafting ships in creative is still fun sometimes but loses its intrigue real quick when you realize you don't have much purpose to use those creations. Therefore for already a good 6 to 8 months I've been mostly watching the forums with only a fraction of my attention just to see if there will ever be the direly needed, drastic change to the priorities and abilities of the Eleon team.
     
    #77
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  18. Arrclyde

    Arrclyde Rear Admiral

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    That is about how it feels for me. I have stopped building (which most of my hundrets and hundrets of hours went into) because after each of the last few patches i opened my creative save to update my blueprints. So i figured it would be better to wait for most devices/blocks are in and than start rebuilding or start from scratch. And since my free time is limited and the options are also limited (no speed up to extremes possible) my survival playthroughs mostly ended by going to the moon of the temperated planet, not leaving the system. So no real testing on this from my side.

    Now when i read that things get more and more complicated without gaining replayablilty, a realistic weight system (which i am not convinced at all, will doanything but to make the game unecessarily more complex with no gameplay value added) i see some drastic changes coming which will impact both: building and survival.
    On the other hand, some basics are missing (crouching is one example) some don't work well (base SI is to sensible, ships without fuel hovering mid air unreachabel) and i me not seeing the direction it is going (overly complex realistic physics sim or fun game with building, exploring, surviving and fighting), i decided to follow the forums, discuss ideas and bring in new sides and perspectives. But playing right now, just for me, is more about wasting time without actually enjoying it. So i guess i pause until the game is more feature complete, then try it (creative and survial) and give feedback based on experience.
     
    #78
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  19. JTurbo

    JTurbo Commander

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    For me, at the present time - reading news about the update brings more pleasure than the game itself.
    Play is not interesting right now. And really is a waste of time. :( There is nothing new to do. from version 3.4.1.0612 we are engaged in one and the same - extraction of resources, construction of ships and bases, search of hostile POI.
    There was a poll: Definition: What does "Improve Exploration" mean to you? - so far, the wishes of the players have not been taken into account. :(

    Personally, I wait until the game introduces something completely new, but not a change in the texture of creatures, landscapes, blocks...
     
    #79
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  20. Runeshadow

    Runeshadow Captain

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    Great job on the terrain update bug. Yall take some time off now. Happy Holidays!!!
     
    #80
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