Loosing all pitch roll yaw

Discussion in 'Experimental Features Discussion' started by riptose, May 11, 2020.

  1. riptose

    riptose Ensign

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    Not sure if this has been covered but im attempting to place some HV thrusters in the nose of the HV. Now as soon as i make room and place a thruster for left and right movement, it resets all pitch roll and yaw values to zero and im unable to turn the HV. If i place them on the outside of the vessel the values go up and works as intended. This is also a new saved creative game that these pics where taken in.

    this picture shows thrusters working (green)
    [​IMG]

    this picture shows thrusters that will zero out yaw, pitch, roll
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
    #1
    Last edited: May 11, 2020
  2. Kal

    Kal Lieutenant

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    they cannot be blocked. 1 is canceling out the other and visa versa.
     
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  3. Vermillion

    Vermillion Rear Admiral

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    Thruster blocking has to be manually enabled through the gameoptions yaml and it doesn't work properly, which is why it hasn't been implemented. If it were enabled, the thrusters would turn themselves off if blocked.

    What we have here appears to be is simple. The thrusters providing yaw are on opposite sides of the center of mass so thruster torque is being applied to the wrong side with backwards calculations resulting in negative torque. If the thrusters were turned around so they're facing the opposite direction this should solve itself.
    You just can't have a thruster on the left side of the ship applying thrust out the right side. It's insane. It makes no sense and the game thinks so too.
     
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  4. FionnMacCumhaill

    FionnMacCumhaill Lieutenant

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    Its worked fine in every version of the game from alpha 9 to alpha 12 release 3 and is fairly common arrangement in pvp builds. If it is no longer working the same way then it is certainly a change.
     
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  5. riptose

    riptose Ensign

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    So after playing around some more its not just thrusters that will zero out my stats. I played around until i could place thrusters and until i was happy with the movement. I started filling in the empty spaceses with blocks and found that i zero'ed out again! Now this BP is from 11.5 and im trying to update for new season.
     
    #5
  6. imlarry425

    imlarry425 Commander

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    Mildly insane maybe but physics wouldn't care if you are okay with a loss in efficiency- otherwise a Cessna couldn't move (thrust created in front of CG) while a Long EZ could .. in practice the Cessna is actually the more efficient of the two since it doesn't need to worry about accelerating turbulent air (the mass ejected by the thruster) or a wrench going through the prop. The concept of port/starboard/dorsal/ventral don't really matter in the plane of the thruster- you could put a thruster anywhere tangent to a circle drawn around the CM and it should always behave (read: apply torque to the airframe) the same way regardless.

    I couldn't repo the problem in either an SV or an HV ... am I missing something with these?

    BassackwardHV.png BassackwardSV.png
     
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  7. FionnMacCumhaill

    FionnMacCumhaill Lieutenant

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    #7
  8. Germanicus

    Germanicus Rear Admiral

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    It's mainly those who build their Vessel for use in PvP who place Thruster in way described here.
    It's still in use, even if some of the more renowned Builders (Spanj and XCal) have "lost" that habit.
     
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  9. RazzleWin

    RazzleWin Rear Admiral

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    Why would they build like that? There must be a reason or there use to be one.
     
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  10. Germanicus

    Germanicus Rear Admiral

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    There is a reason: Covered Truster - invisible and therefore not to be shot at (directly). Grouped like hell to maximize maneuverability dogging incoming Fire. And many are from the earlier times and just upgraded... 30 Truster to the left, 30 Truster to the right, 60 Truster forward and backward...and 196-382 RCS... I saw those "THINGS" while playing PvP. Disgusting:rolleyes:
     
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  11. RazzleWin

    RazzleWin Rear Admiral

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    Did they come with BORG too?:eek:
     
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  12. Germanicus

    Germanicus Rear Admiral

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    For the OP: I have build this SV back in A10 or even before. It suffers no such thing as stated here. It did not change any of its abilities and still works in the boundaries it was build for - long endurance Recon, therefore only 4 Gatlings, but Shields and Warp. Also a bit of Cargo space 3500 Volume.
    CAE1242914_2020-05-25_09-45-11.png CAE1242914_2020-05-25_09-45-17.png CAE1242914_2020-05-25_09-58-43.png
    Recon-mode is 30m/s
    Full Thrust - 130m/s in Space - 70m/s on Planet.
    Hovering time about 20hours
    Shield active about 9 hours.
    CAE1242914_2020-05-25_10-27-43.png
    Lvl 12 T3 99% - has to be tweaked a bit because of the changes of A12EXP
     
    #12
  13. krazzykid2006

    krazzykid2006 Rear Admiral

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    It's not just for PvP purposes.
    I have always (until recently) placed my thrusters on the opposite side and pointing inwards instead of outwards for one very simple reason, the damn thruster flares/effects are bloody blinding. They have always hurt my eyes and I've pleaded to the developers to either tone them down or give us a slider in the graphics settings on more than one occasion now.

    The same way that the overly bright and flashy effects from some of the tools hurt my eyes and give me headaches after a while.
    Even turning down the brightness setting in the graphics settings has no effect on them, and even if it did it would make the rest of the game too dark as a result.

    The only reason I stopped was because of the feature of thrusters providing turning torque now. It was causing me all kinds of issues if I pointed my thrusters inward instead of outward so I was forced against my will to stop building that way.

    For the record I never buried them behind blocks or anything like that. They were still on the outside as they would be normally. They were just on the opposite side and pointing inwards instead of outwards.
    So my front thrusters would be in the back but pointing forwards, back in the front and pointing back, etc, etc.
    It worked exactly the same and had the benefit of shielding my eyes, up until they added that feature in anyways.
     
    #13
    Last edited: May 25, 2020
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  14. RazzleWin

    RazzleWin Rear Admiral

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    I agree 200% !!
     
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  15. Germanicus

    Germanicus Rear Admiral

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    @krazzykid2006 ...blinding...good point. At least for me, the Thruster Flares are sometimes irritating.
     
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  16. Vermillion

    Vermillion Rear Admiral

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    Yeah, but if they flipped the thrusters so they're still in the same place but facing in the opposite direction they fix their own problem AND get more torque out of the deal since the output of the thruster would be further from the center of mass. Also, since the "attachment" side of the thrusters is their back, the mass of the thrusters will be positioned closer towards the center, making turning easier.
     
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  17. Germanicus

    Germanicus Rear Admiral

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    Agreed.
     
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