CURRENTLY not reproducible Signals though gates work intermittently.

Discussion in 'Currently not reproducible' started by tahaan, Dec 21, 2021.

  1. tahaan

    tahaan Lieutenant

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2021
    Messages:
    54
    Likes Received:
    19
    Build: v1.7 3632 (all builds for as long as I have been playing)
    Mode: Survival
    Mode: Any

    SERVER NAME: Any / N.a
    SEED-ID: not available.

    If applicable:
    MODIFIED PLAYFIELDS: No.

    Reproducibility: Intermittent.
    Severity: Major

    Type: Issue with signals.

    Summary: Signals though gates work intermittently.

    Description: A ramp connected to the output from an OR gate, with the inputs connected to various switches, works unreliably. In 99% of the cases, exit and reloading the game sorts out the issue. Rarely even just a Warp or teleport to another system and back will also cause it to reload and start working.

    Example and steps to reproduce:
    The output from an OR gate feeds to a hanger door and the ramp (inverted). One of the inputs is from a Control Panel Signal (named Manual Door Open) and the other input is from a motion sensor.

    As part of debugging, add 3 Lights. One light is set to follow the OR gate output and the other two respectively follow the two input signals (Manual Door Open and the Motion sensor).

    The expectation is that either input signal should consistently trigger the OR gate output. The experience is that it is unreliable. Sometimes nothing works, but that is rare. More often one or the other signal works.

    Occasionally it all works and any of the OR gate inputs will open the door as expected.

    For a more complex example that I have observed to have a much higher chance of misbehaving, use a 4-input OR gate. Connect it as above, with the extra inputs going to another sensor and a Lever (switch). Here the two motion sensors cover two different areas, eg outside and inside.

    Something else that consistently breaks it, is when attempting to use the output signal from a lever to turn any Sensor On/Off. Seems it all stops working the moment I do that and trying to undo the change results in it never working again, to the point where I've gone and deleted all signals, levers, and sensors, in order to "start over". This is sad as I would really like a way to use a Lever to temporarily turn the motion sensor off.

    In summary it seems that the more complex a signal setup is, the higher the likeliness of it misbehaving.

    Disclaimer: As a long time student of electronic cuircuits and coding logic, I have a solid understanding of the principles of AND / OR / XOR etc. I am confident that I have the signals configured correctly, and have experienced this issue over many builds and many ships and structures where I've tried to use it.
     
    #1
    Ente likes this.
  2. Pantera

    Pantera Administrator
    Staff Member

    • Developer
    • Moderator
    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2016
    Messages:
    7,946
    Likes Received:
    9,017
    Hello,

    Please supply a copy of the save game with a vessel you have setup where this has happened for you.
    How to attach a save game to a report:
    Go to:
    For SP or Co-op:
    Right click on "Empyrion" in your steam library > Properties > Local files > Browse > Saves > Games
    or: SteamLibrary\steamapps\Common\Empyrion - Galactic Survival\Saves\Games

    For MP:
    Right click on "Empyrion - Dedicated Server" in your steam library > Properties > Local files > Browse > Saves > Games
    or: SteamLibrary\steamapps\Common\Empyrion - Dedicated Server\Saves\Games
    1. Right click on the save folder & place your mouse cursor over 'Send to' create a compressed copy of it (or use winzip or 7zip)
    2. Drag & drop a copy in your reply box or use the upload a file option on the forum.
    3. If the folder is too large use a file hosting site like mediafire, dropbox or google drive & add a share link to it
    4. If you are sending us the info via an email please add a share link to the file or files you have uploaded
     
    #2
  3. tahaan

    tahaan Lieutenant

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2021
    Messages:
    54
    Likes Received:
    19
    This Blueprint is from a game I am playing on a community server and is a Refrged Eden build.

    I don't have one readily available for vanilla Empyrion. I can try to make a version of it for EGS without any kind of mods or custom scenarios, but I suspect you are more practised at doing that. Still let me know if you want me to do that.

    https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1BxlEz68HiBhZnHmy4SloPcRIZLr2R00M?usp=sharing
     
    #3
  4. tahaan

    tahaan Lieutenant

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2021
    Messages:
    54
    Likes Received:
    19
    I have uploaded a video. In this instance the thing that is misbehaving is the msInside signal.

    That signal is used by two things - a Light (for debugging purposes) and input into an AND gate.

    Despite the debugging light being on permanently, the AND gate never turns on its output. (The other input for this AND gate is the levelon the wall. The output goes to one of the 4x OR gate inputs to open the hangar door.)

    The other two inputs to the 4x OR gate work - one being the Outside Motions sensor (msOutside) and the other being the Control panel signal.

    If I exit and re-connect to the game the issue will change and any commbination of things will work or stop working seemingly randomly. Sometimes all of them work but that seems rare.
     
    #4
  5. tahaan

    tahaan Lieutenant

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2021
    Messages:
    54
    Likes Received:
    19
    And a little while later, without a single change being made, it works as it should. The only thing that could be related s that I hopped into my SV and did fly off to chase some "heavy bombers" that came to bother me. On returning I notice it is all working as it should.
     
    #5
  6. Taski

    Taski Ensign

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2021
    Messages:
    14
    Likes Received:
    10
    noticed that if an SV or HV is parked in the CV, the response field of the sensor of which intersects with the response field of the sensor of the hangar gates and ramps of a large ship, then the gates and ramps stop closing automatically. If I deploy a small ship in the hangar with its nose to the gate (thus the response fields of the gate and small ship sensors do not intersect), then the gates and ramps start working normally
     
    #6
  7. tahaan

    tahaan Lieutenant

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2021
    Messages:
    54
    Likes Received:
    19
    Thank you @Taski, I will pay attention to see if there is a correlation between my issue and where I have parked SVs in the hanger. I suspect that is not the issue but I will certainly keep an eye on it.
     
    #7
  8. Baz

    Baz Ensign

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2021
    Messages:
    1
    Likes Received:
    0
    I have the same problem with many signals. ie : a shutter door is set to inverse of signal 001. Even if all conditions are met for sig001 to be 0, the shutter door won't behave as supposed. If I flip a switch related to the circuit On and then OFF, then the shutter door behaves like it should.

    It happens with timers, XNOR, inverse signals.

    Suggestion : As a player approaches or get in a base or vehicle, the actual position of every switches could be read, and every circuits initiated?
    It often seems like I have to trigger a component of the circuit, then it starts behaving properly after that. As if some circuits were non functional until a switch, signal, timer or move det. is triggered, then the circuits runs fine
     
    #8
  9. tahaan

    tahaan Lieutenant

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2021
    Messages:
    54
    Likes Received:
    19
    When I set up a very simple signal, eg ControlPanel switch -> Device, or Motion Sensor -> Signal -> Device, it works consistently - I have never had a problem. Even when a single signal triggers several devices, there is no issue.

    When I use gates, it works inconsistently.

    Step 1: Condition changes (eg move in or out of sensor range, or change lever, or delay time expire, or Control panel signal switched on/off
    Step 2: Signal follows
    Step 3: Input into gate follows signal
    Step 4: Gate processes all inputs and determines output
    Step 5: Output signal follows
    Step 6: Repeat with this signal if it goes into another gate
    Step 7: Devices that follow this signal receives the changed input and state updates (eg light turns on, door opens, shield turns off, etc)

    In my video you can see the light connected to the output turn on before the input signal to the gate that produces the output signal.

    My subjective guess is that there is a polling system that processes signals and changes the state of devices, and that sometimes some signals are being omitted from the sequence. It seems that from time to time the entire signaling configuration / sequence gets reloaded (I am guessing this happens when the playfield is loaded, but it seems that that is not the only time),and when that happens sometimes the omitted ones suddenly gets included, but just as often some different signals gets left out.
     
    #9
  10. Pantera

    Pantera Administrator
    Staff Member

    • Developer
    • Moderator
    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2016
    Messages:
    7,946
    Likes Received:
    9,017
    I haven't had any success triggering this on my own server & also tried in this co-op mode.
    Do you know of any steps that can reliably make it happen on your own server or maybe co-op mode if you cannot setup your own server ?

    Steps:
    1)
    2)
    etc
     
    #10
  11. tahaan

    tahaan Lieutenant

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2021
    Messages:
    54
    Likes Received:
    19
    @Pantera I have actually not really seen the issue since @Taski suggeted that it may be related to a docked vessel within the sensor area. Since reading that I have paid attention to where I park other vessels and made an attempt to make sure I dock them further forward in the hanger.

    I will now change that arround and park near the hangar door and see if things start acting up again.
     
    #11
  12. tahaan

    tahaan Lieutenant

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2021
    Messages:
    54
    Likes Received:
    19
    At the end of my last session playing, I left my SV parked right inside the hanger door.

    As I flew in, everything was working as expected, the hanger opened, I flew in, and the moment I docked I became invisible to the sensor and the doorclosed even though I was in range of the sensor. This I expect as I'm used to it, but in reality I do feel like it might be technically "unexpected behaviour".

    When I got out I was again seen by the sensor and the hanger opened ( I walked away immediately, so the door closed - this is still as expected)

    I signed out with the SV there.

    Today I signed in and momentarily forgot about this issue. I did not go into the hanger area so didn't notice for a few minutes. When I started flying I went into 3rd person view and noticed right away that the hanger door was open.

    So I went into the hanger area and did a few "tests".

    1. The hanger was open even though it should not have been.
    2. I noticed that all the signal "debug lights" were on.
    3. I only expected one of them to be on - The one on the far right for the lever. (Note the second light form the left is currently unused and will always be on as it has no signals connected)

    The first thing I did was to walk into the sensor area, and then back out. The hangar door closed and the sensor lights all went to the right state.

    4. Repeated this a few times and it worked as expected.
    5. Turned the lever on and off a few times - the debug light followed it correctly every time.
    6. Tested that the lever worked as expected by moving in and out of the sensor area: Found that as expected with the lever turned off, the hangar door stayed closed.
    7. Left the lever in the On position and moved around, thinking that it was only a momentary glitch and that everything was back to normal.
    8. Immediately after that the hangar door stayed open even when I left the sensor area. I moved back to make sure I'm well out of the pickup area, the hangar doors stayed open. This is unexpected behaviour.
    9. I moved closer, into the sensor area, and out again. The hanger doors closed as they should.
    10 After that I did not observe any more issues, but I ended my session there because I wanted to report my findings here.

    All of this corroborates the idea mentioned by @Taski that this is affected by a vehicle docked inside the sensor pickup area.

    If there is a bug logged for the issue of a player becoming "invisible" to sensors when sitting inside a docked vessel, inside a sensor's area, then I suspect this bug is related.

    I do think I saw a bug report for a player becoming invisible to sensors when entering a seat or the cockpit of a vessel (Not a docked vessel). That may also be related.

    I will keep doing more testing, and will start a recording when I play again, to get a better record of how to reproduce this issue.
     
    #12
  13. tahaan

    tahaan Lieutenant

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2021
    Messages:
    54
    Likes Received:
    19
    The result is as expected. With a vessel docked within the sensor area, the signals work inconsistently.

    I have uploaded a new video to the same shared directory, with filename "2022-01-17 17-27-41.mkv"
     
    #13
  14. Pantera

    Pantera Administrator
    Staff Member

    • Developer
    • Moderator
    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2016
    Messages:
    7,946
    Likes Received:
    9,017
    Thanks for your updates for this. Each time I rejoin the server I have this setup on or come back to the CV you have supplied after being away in other playfields the signals are always maintained & working correctly.
    I also have added some vessels placed in the sensor detection area with & without their own motions sensors to cause more overlap (thinking something might trigger from that) but no issue triggers.

    Can you try this on your own stand-alone dedi server ? you can download it for free via steam > tools "Empyrion Galactic Survival - Dedicated Server" or you may also try the client's co-op mode which is using a dedi server also just to see if you can reliably trigger it a few times.
     
    #14
  15. tahaan

    tahaan Lieutenant

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2021
    Messages:
    54
    Likes Received:
    19
    @Pantera I will try it in an SP game as well as with a Dedi on my own PC and will report back once I have some results.
     
    #15

Share This Page