Feedback Required The Eleon Official Servers Reflection (EU/US)

Discussion in 'Official Eleon Server' started by RexXxuS, Jul 1, 2019.

  1. RexXxuS

    RexXxuS Administrator

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    Hi Survivalists,

    as you know I'm the Owner of the Invader vs Defender Scenario and the official servers.
    @Taelyn helping me with administrating it.

    Due moving in real life and other busy things, I am not always 100% involved in every action happen on these servers and could not fully utilize all the new cool stuff from Eleon into this Scenario.
    So I appreciate discussions made here in the forum. Be it feedback or suggestions.

    Recently a topic came up regarding "Meta of the Official Servers". What is the purpose of it and why are they configured as they are right now?

    As said couple of times: the Official Servers are meant for players who just bought the game and testing Multiplayer or want to test MP after played Singleplayer.
    The feature set is intentionally set lower and the rules set as well to not overwhelm those new players with too many regulations or learning curve (as other servers have).
    However, Veterans should have a place there too, but since they know the Scope of the game and other Multiplayer Servers much more, there is a natural imbalance of knowledge or skills, which would harm the first goal mentioned above.
    Hence for Veterans we either have to go with Universe "hotspot" changes or rule sets or the points below.

    That brings us to the point what do you think the current situation is on the official servers (EU/US)?

    Few inspirations for the discussion:
    • Should the PDA get more missions / Tutorial Missions?
    • Are the starter planets properly scaled in terms of difficulty - too easy / too difficult?
    • Are there enough variations in terms of planets / orbits / resource distribution?
    • Is the Universe overall scaled enough or too small / big?
    • Is the introduction to PvP good for new players?
      • Regarding the Universe: are there enough alternative warp routes?
      • Even for more advanced PvP players, are there any bottlenecks?
      • Are there PvP rules which are missing?
      • Are there essential PvP limits which new and old players would benefit from?
      • Are there enough "hotspots" in the universe to get "guaranteed PvP"?
    Feel free to answer to all of those points or new ones to improve the Official Server experience!
    As always, keep it constructive, without any finger pointing etc.

    Thanks.
    RexXxuS
     
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  2. -=Ice=-

    -=Ice=- Ensign

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    1) remove all AG zones on planets around POIs and deposits in PVP, as you did on HWS. Even if you dug out deposit AG zone stays. If you vessel is damaged near deposit you can't even repair it. Its awful, you can't repair, can't place a base near deposit (you need to more like 200+ meters, don't remember exact number now), etc.
    2) SV warp drive is not in demand right now, cause all distances are long and it isn't possible to travel somewhere with SV. You always need to take a CV which is not convenient, especially if you play alone. So maybe reduce distanse between systems.
    3) we need egs:recycle here :rolleyes: cause now, for example, there are many useless dead vessels in Pandora Space, nobody whats to recycle it with multitool, and they just loading playfield and server.
     
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  3. RadElert_007

    RadElert_007 Commander

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    Not necessary, I usually skip them outright because they are just pointless tasks that dont really teach you anything

    The particular planet I started on, Kelt was a pain in the ass. It wasnt nessicarily difficult but extremely time consuming to make any real progress, the planet is too large how how many deposits are on it, especially for new players who do not have access to bikes or faster modes of transportation.

    Resource scarcity is non-existant, resource scarcity should push players to explore systems outside of their "home"

    Decrease the size of planets and decrease the amount of deposits in PvE playfields, PvP playfields should be more abundant so that they serve as a conflict driver to encourage people to enter PvP

    Planets are too large, too much space between landmarks and deposits. The official server does not have enough players active to justify such large planets especially due to the quantity of planets available.

    Perhaps there should be warnings to inform players that they have entered PvP and the risks they are taking.

    There should be less alternative warp routes, having PvP chokepoints is a good thing as it creates content by forcing player interaction.

    See above.

    No, less regulation is better as it means the admins have less workload and it encourages innovation.

    Class size limit should be at Eleon's default limit of 6 if it isnt already or even lower. Permitting larger ships create stagnant PvP due to creating a "brick tank" meta which means that Cv space fights can go on for hours, which makes them less fun.

    Perhaps even implementing changes to the config to balance offence vs defence scaling to futher decrease fight times and make "hard kills" more common.

    See my answer to questions concerning alternative warp routes.
     
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  4. Sly Comrade

    Sly Comrade Ensign

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    • Should the PDA get more missions / Tutorial Missions?
    • I have no real comment on that. Although it certainly would make sense to give some nice rewards for this and make especially newer player go through it, because often enough recently they asked the simplest of questions and a tutorial with good reward should be enough incentive to learn the basics faster. :)
    • Are the starter planets properly scaled in terms of difficulty - too easy / too difficult?
    • I started on the PvP starter and while as an experienced players it was no trouble getting around, i felt there was little (2!) interesting POIs to do. Talon are all but useless these days (except for the Temple). I feel the planet should have been slightly bigger with more Zirax or Alien POIs ranging from easy to hard (to avoid people rushing through them too quickly).
    • Are there enough variations in terms of planets / orbits / resource distribution?
    • Is the Universe overall scaled enough or too small / big?
    • To answer both questions: I believe the current setup has a few things done well and a few things done very badly. While there should be a area worth fighting over (PvP) I do NOT believe in forcing PvE players to cross through PvP in order to get through other PvE areas. Maybe PvP should generally be richer of the more rare resources but it should be a system of planets by itself connecting to a PvE system of planets. This way you prevent hungry PvP wolves from hunting down new guys who just want to go from one PvE system to another. Also the Galactic Market Place ideally should be accessible from both PvP and PvE AND it should have an admin trading station and maybe trading stations for all the faction (or at least Zirax and Polaris).

    • Is the introduction to PvP good for new players?
      • Regarding the Universe: are there enough alternative warp routes?
      • As stated above, forcing PvE players to go through PvP is wrong. Everyone has their own play style. However they should be enticed to visit PvP areas due to richness of resources or other reasons (risk vs reward).
      • Even for more advanced PvP players, are there any bottlenecks?
      • Are there PvP rules which are missing?
      • Currently it seems very popular to use special SV designs to clip into CVs. This should not be allowed as its clearly an exploit. Generally using SVs or HVs as so called pingers should not be allowed because they are hard to spot and because their components (like flares) will glitch right into your ship making it impossible to move. This has been exploited pretty badly, especially on EU and it kills the fun for both experienced PvPers but especially for new guys. So ANY attempt of glitching an SV or HV into a CV should be an offense - apart from actually flying one into someones hangar bay (which is something you can actually defend against). Also SV designs that are obviously designed to make CVs glitch into its components should be an offense (SVs with a lot of flares or other small components in random places). It should further be forbidden to spawn a new SV mid fight with the purpose of glitching that one into a moving CV.
      • Pingers itself should be allowed IF they are clearly visible. Maybe only allow base pingers where the base must have generator, fuel tank etc. and where all blocks MUST connect to eachother. Because the EAH base attack message is actually important and you cannot prevent people from building actual bases, so its hard to completely get rid of those pingers. However there should be ingame messages clearly warning new players of these pingers.
      • Other comments:
    • 1. The so called autominer planet, which Alpha in Alpha Centauri is supposed to be, should have all the resources and all of them should be non depletable. Currently some are depletable and it only got Zasc and Magnesium but no Erestrum.
    • 2. I feel as the official servers really ARE the first impression new players get of Empyrion MP (and some dont even bother at all with SP) planets and POIs should be getting some more love. Maybe one of the HWS POIs could be transfered over. It might be good for HWS too as its the next step up, but only if people actually stay interested.
    • 3. Hardware should be upgraded and capacity should be increased to at least 60-80. At this point in time, especially after a fresh wipe, players have a hard time to even get on the server. Larger scale battles etc should be lag free to again not discourage people from playing MP. It also allows more people to actually join regularly and experience the game in MP.
    • 4. Personally I feel the game the galaxy should be roughly doubled in size for both PvE and PvP. (also to have less lag and stability issues in PvE.
    • 5. Resources should regenerate more often on planets. Noone wants to start when after just a week most planets have been mined out. All potential new players are discouraged and go elsewhere or quit.
     
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  5. mybrainismelting

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    The starter planets are in a horrible state.

    -Deposits and POIs need to be refreshed at least bi-weekly if not more often considering the kind of traffic they are getting. The meteorites that are supposed to be falling after all of a particular resource's deposits are depleted are failing to do so.

    -There are insufficient ore bearing rocks in all three of the basic resources categories on the crash zones where players are supposed to be getting their first resources for building.

    -There needs to be at least one starter planet that has a two way warp, allowing a player to get a pickup from friends etc. Obviously it shouldn't be the PvP one. The description in the starter select menu should be marked so players can see this.
     
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  6. Sly Comrade

    Sly Comrade Ensign

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    One other thing i forgot to ask for:

    Add a chat bar for PvP chatter - PvP chatter can get pretty rough at times and put newer players off. Of course they still would have the chance to see it, but at least they dont have to. :)
     
    #6
  7. mybrainismelting

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    As far as PvP resources:

    -Any Resources in PvP zones should be highly concentrated in order to focus player attentions there and better generate conflict over them.

    I hate to admit it, but a FEW, VERY SLOW regenerating Z/E deposits/asteroids should be in PvE somewhere just so those people can finally stop their whining. To keep a strong risk/reward dynamic, add more Z/E to PvP space in Pandora.
     
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  8. Sly Comrade

    Sly Comrade Ensign

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    On that note - I always thought it should not be the resources that people fight over. Everyone should have access to all the resources. This would also help PvP IF there was something else to fight for that people really want to have. I have no clear idea what this could possibly be but this current setup where people fight over Z and E just prevents people from building proper ships which is certainly not the right direction.

    It could be gold if you would give gold more sense. Similar to HWS where you can buy rare ships or whatever with it. But there are certainly other options too.
     
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  9. RadElert_007

    RadElert_007 Commander

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    Risk vs reward, marketplace should be accessible from PvP only to promote piracy gameplay.
     
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  10. RadElert_007

    RadElert_007 Commander

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    If you have no alternative to offer then perhaps it should stay the same as it is right now, Z and E is heavily locked down by some factions on the US server but that hasnt caused any issues.
     
    #10
  11. Calhoun

    Calhoun Ensign

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    • Should the PDA get more missions / Tutorial Missions?
    For myself, I don't really care. However newer players might appreciate a tutorial quest system that covers the general basics. Many new players already ask questions that should be common sense, so extra missions may help there.

    • Are the starter planets properly scaled in terms of difficulty - too easy / too difficult?
    The starters are not hard for anyone who has played a little, however they are incredibly tedious and poorly designed. On some planets resource rocks are not anywhere near each other, which coupled with too few deposits means early game is very slow and boring. There are also issues with the spawning kit, which compounds these annoyances.

    • Are there enough variations in terms of planets / orbits / resource distribution?
    • Is the Universe overall scaled enough or too small / big?
    These kind of go together. The universe size and layout is good in my opinion, as there is enough variety without increasing lag. the layout with a central choke point is good, although some players expressed they would like to be able to jump between PvE systems on the same 'side'. Resource distribution is mediocre to fair. Endgame materials, like Erestrum and Zascosium, are moderately rare, however bulk mats. such as iron and Sathium are extremely common, meaning no resource scarcity or conflict drive exits for these. The planet 'Alpha' is an outlier as it has indestructible terrain, and should be removed in my opinion.

    • Is the introduction to PvP good for new players?
    Yes. PvP as a whole has far and away more depth than PvE could ever have. Generally despite the stereotype, PvPers are willingly to teach new players if they ask, as that only leads to better fights anyway and is a win-win for everyone.


    • Regarding the Universe: are there enough alternative warp routes?
    There are currently no alternative warp routes, however with the way warp drives work in this game it's a non-issue as interdiction does not exist. As there is already a fair rule against warp camping, there is no issue here.


    • Even for more advanced PvP players, are there any bottlenecks?
    • Are there enough "hotspots" in the universe to get "guaranteed PvP"?
    Currently Pandora serves as a bottleneck or chokepoint. This serves as such fairly due to the rarity of Ere and Zasc, although this could be expanded with another chokepoint focused on Sathium.

    • Are there PvP rules which are missing?
    • Are there essential PvP limits which new and old players would benefit from?
    Generally PvP works best with as few limiting rules as possible. Apart from things that are effectively uncounterable, such as warp camping or fully burying devices in anti-grief for example, PvP should be self-regulating. As mentioned by another member, clipping vehicles inside other things should fall into that category.
     
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  12. Sly Comrade

    Sly Comrade Ensign

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    Or maybe YOU should help and think what the alternative could be. People on US fly paper ships an die fast. I would say that IS a problem.
    Everyone should be easily able to build a PvP ship without having to worry about the resources.

    And yes, in lack of alternatives it still should be Z and E because otherwise noone but very few guys will ever venture into a PvP zone.
     
    #12
  13. mybrainismelting

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    #13
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  14. Taelyn™

    Taelyn™ Administrator
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  15. mybrainismelting

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    Sure, why not?
     
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  16. Taelyn™

    Taelyn™ Administrator
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    just wanted to be sure :), ill bring it up to add some PvP ships. Might be a good idea :)
     
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  17. -=Tone=-

    -=Tone=- Ensign

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    My take on the us server is that a few more planets added in new sectors with moons would be nice just 3 to 4 new sectors. Could make more than one way to get accross the sectors instead of having to go though pandora sector. Planet sizes are perfect in the size classes of 2 and 3 I find the resources are ok I easily get what I need.
    Ship class sizes are fine.

    Having some admin trading stations that cant be blown up by players would be good

    The biggest problem I see is with these dectors/alarms that players are putting in space there is way to many of them being put down cluttering sectors and what even worst is that there being put at warp points so any new players comming out to explore get blown up quickly because as soon as they jump in or out someone is there and is shooting them makes a new player not want to play so I think that should be removed especially at warp points.


    Ag zones are fine if there removed from pois player will just by pass defenses and dig under pois.
     
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  18. RadElert_007

    RadElert_007 Commander

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    Proper PvP ships as prefabs would be wonderful, good way to introduce new players to PvP design philosophy.


    Though I think that the LiCorp designs NaStral uploaded if they were considered would either need an in game explanation attached to them on how certain things work (I am sure myself or NaStral are happy to provide) or be edited with a few signs to explain things, I know that some of the design techniques used in LiCorp designs might make zero sense to a new player.
     
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  19. mybrainismelting

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    I can add display panels with the relevant information to all my public ships later tonight when I return from work.
     
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  20. notmanhattan

    notmanhattan Lieutenant

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    I agree almost entirely with red and calhoun

    the universe is a good size, as it has a main pvp hotspot (pandora), a few secondary pvp areas (1 jump away from pandora), and the pve areas. however, the resource distribution could use some work, as currently theres no reason to go to the secondary pvp areas since they share the same resources as the pve areas, this could be fixed by having the pve areas (ex. plys) contain mainly the basic resources (iron copper silicon cobalt) with small amount of more advanced resources (neo sath pentax) and then have the secondary pvp areas (ex. ursa) contain the basic resources and the more advanced resources in larger quantities. then keep pandora as the main source of zasc/ere/magn. also what cal said about alpha is true, basically nothing happens there since you cant mine the resources with drills.

    as both of them said, having more rules is generally a bad idea, since it just leads to more work for admins and discourages new ideas for pvp. generally the only things rules should ban are things which players have no way to counter (warp camping with bases, alts with offline protection overlapping, etc)

    tone mentioned alarms, which dont really need to be removed, as they do not prevent players from gathering resources, they just mean that people cant stick around in pandora with 0 risk since it is difficult to find people without alarms. also, adding more warp paths outside pandora is pointless since players can just quickly warp through pandora with near 0 risk of getting attacked unless someone is warp camping with bases

    adding licorp ships as pvp prefabs (labeled as pvp ships) with explanations to why the ships are built like they are would greatly help new players in general ship building along with giving them a solid option to use so they dont get killed constantly in pvp, as the current tutorials dont give new players any idea how to build a good ship most end up flying bad steam workshop ships then get discouraged from pvp once they die in a single hit
     
    #20

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