"Splash" is actually a bad term choice from the devs, but it's used in many games to illustrate that the damage "spreads" like a messy splash. In fact it is a shock wave, and these affect structures to different degrees even through walls. I'm not a physicist, someone else might explain it better. I have seen videos where 500 - pounds of Tnt are detonated, and people in a bunker some hundreds of meters from there felt the shockwave going through them and the structure, but none was injured. So maybe the game has a very rough "shockwave" mechanic, and I dislike it genuinely, like many others.
This is true. I'm not a physicist, but I've always been interested in real life tank combat. All sorts of bad effects can happen on the inside of the armor when enough force is applied to the outside. Shock damage, spalling, etc. Like Kassonade said, splash damage is probably a poor choice in terminology.
I can see how that works, but it would have to be an extreme amount of splash damage to be able to 1 shot an armoured cockpit with 1800 points of HP.
{ +Item Id: 155, Name: IONCannonCharge Class: Projectile Damage: 420 BlastParticleIndex: 3 BlastRadius: 3, display: true BlastDamage: 500, display: true { +Item Id: 159, Name: IONCannonCharge2 Class: Projectile Damage: 420 BlastParticleIndex: 3 BlastRadius: 3, display: true BlastDamage: 500, display: true { +Item Id: 164, Name: TurretEnemyLaserCharge Class: Projectile Damage: 650, display: true # new: because we removed explosion BlastParticleIndex: 0 # BlastRadius: 3 # BlastDamage: 200 ------------------------------------------------------- Notice here that they "commented out" (disabled) splash damage for enemy lasers... but it's still possible to have lasers do "splash damage" in the game... well... I have no idea how it all works, frankly. Is all damage dealt equally through 3 blocks deep, with no energy loss in the process ? The cockpit having the volume of many blocks, does it receive some compounded damage from all its "neighbour" blocks ? But note this : most of your ship's devices also deal splash damage when they explode, and they have much lower hitpoints than your cockpit. So if one hit destroyed many of these devices, then you have to add all these devices' explosive damage to the splash damage received by the cockpit from the original blast. Since all this happens rather simultaneously, you may perceive only 1 big hit/ explosion, while in fact many devices also disappeared at that moment. Just for example : { +Block Id: 449, Name: ThrusterSVRoundNormal HitPoints: 300 BlastRadius: 3 BlastDamage: 100 { +Block Id: 470, Name: FuelTankSVSmall (CV small fuel tank has only 50 hitpoints, SV is surely same or less) BlastRadius: 5 BlastDamage: 300 { +Block Id: 471, Name: GeneratorSVSmall HitPoints: 125 BlastRadius: 3 BlastDamage: 200 You can also check during battle the amount of damage received, and this could be a good way to try to understand the process. Any hit your ship suffered may have affected up to 3-blocks distance, so even if your cockpit was "hidden" it may have taken damage from "splash" 3 blocks away. ------------------------------------------------------ You can see all these values in the ItemsConfig.ecf file, in your Empyrion\Content\Configuration folder. -----------------------------------------------------
I believe its the laser turrets doing EXTREME damage compared to how they are supposed to work or at least have worked in the past to the point that shields are almost worthless AND a damage nerf on player artillery turrets affecting the drone base. As I said I sat back and arced shots into the drone base out of it's range and did almost nothing to the shields, I was never going to be able to take it down with just artillery. By comparison I sustained massive damage with every volley from them. I don't even think a capital ship could do any good. BUT here is the comedy bit. There was a zirax capital ship parked next to the drone base, my compadre tried straffing it in his SV a few times before he got devastated by the drone base and had to limp home. I pulled my modded Onix around out of their range and started raining arty shells on the Zirax CV.....blew the hell out of it. A few shots to zero in the vector and the turrets on top of it blew off, then some other chunks went off and then I am assuming I got lucky and dug into the core or hit a fuel tank/generator because it exploded a bit, flew into the air where it flipped upside down and landed back down next to the drone base. I laughed my fool head off. I mean it was a Pyrrhic victory, I couldnt loot it or the drone base would destroy me in 3 volleys. But at least it was something. Late last night after I posted here I scoured HV blueprints that allow you to tunnel under the drone base and blow up the generators/core from underneath where it is safe. I just dont have it in me to keep going though. Last night was kind of the last straw for this game. Somebody really screwed the pooch with the drone bases, they were not always like this. They used to be a tough fight but at least you had a chance against them. This is just stupid.
It's not the drone base, it's the bugged laser turrets that is the problem. You can take out an entire drone base POI compound with a T3 light fighter SV made out of carbon and a shield. Or just use pretty much any shielded cv. It's really easy, once the turret damage bug is fixed.
My first language is French, so I may not perfectly understand the meaning of this, so correct me if I'm wrong... Are you talking about the 1-block spacing in walls to... avoid... splash... in PvP ?
Because. You're quite right. It doesn't, they are and they should. Or at least they should be mitigating it *a lot*, which they aren't. Too complex to code, I suppose. Mybe this is one of the things they're going to "refine" later. Currently you need to leave an air gap to any outside wall that's likely to take blast damage in order to avoid damage to things next to the wall. Daft.
That's what I was thinking as well. I can understand some of the damage going through due to physics, but the full force of it being able to penetrate through up to 3 layers of blocks just does not sound right to me.
There is no such thing as "overpowered" NPCs. There are only more or less prepared and ingenious players. In short: Git Gud.
I have not yet assaulted any of the Zirax bases in this new build, so I am speaking out my arse just a bit. But IMO, in the past, the Zirax were an absolute joke. The base attacks (even on hardest+hardest+hardest settings) are STILL a joke. One rocket turret plus a couple support projectile turrets takes out every single one without so much as me breaking a sweat. In coop or multi it would be even more of a joke. So, I'm getting just about to the point of assaulting a Zirax base, but I'm not going to be stupid about it and assault the STRONGEST faciltity in the game (Drone base right?) with the weakest option possible (HV, no matter if it IS a battle tank, still weaker than an SV or a CV). I'll probably pick a small fry facility that isn't even inside their territory (I notice some kinda thing like that) and do a Russian Sapping assault. Milk it for XP, then see how much I can salvage before the swarm me. I'm guessing they won't even swarm me really even though this external facility is only lik 300 m outside a Zirax territory zone and maybe 1.5 km from a major enclave of facilities. Which is to say: if a player is smart, nothing in the game may be quite so "overpowered and out of balance" as if a player is dull. Sorry to be so blunt that is my hunch. Consider this analogy to 21st century United States. An alien has crash landed in Vermont. He/she/it is running around picking flowers and chopping down trees and harassing the local pets. Civilians are reporting some bizarre flying spaghetti Monster **** out in the woods . . . at first official discount it but after a couple days, they decide to send the local sheriff to investigate. Local sheriff gets vaporized and his squad car gets commandeered and salvaged for parts! One of his deputies in a second squad car sees this happen right in front of his eyes and barely escapes with his life. NOW what is gonna happen!? Well in EGS, what happens is (by analogy), the U.S. military sends a platoon of marines in a drop craft. They promptly get vaporized, turned into grilled hamburgers and THEIR vehicle and weapons scrapped for parts. Next the U.S. military sends a single F-16 to scout the location and IT gets show down, vaporized, scrapped and devoured. Then another couple humvees of marines. . . then a couple of light helicopters . . . and on and on and on sending personnel and machines into the eternal meat grinder of the alien enclave in the woods of Vermont. THIS is how the Zirax behave in the game, i.e., COMPLETELY UNREALISTICALLY. At some point--if the desire were to balance for realism more than for gameplay--then the Zirax would literally send a squadron of CVs to orbitally bombard the players bases and minibike into eternal oblivion. Now I'm NOT arguing for this, as it would be sucky bad balance: overpowered so to speak. "Too realistic." But this is to put into perspective what truly IS and IS NOT "overpowered" in a game like this. There needs to be some challenge, and if the strongest Zirax facility in the game can be taken out by a singleplayer in an HV then what challenge is there?
The turrets were bugged and the weakest t1 basic laser turret was doing the highest shield damage of any of the alien turrets. It did more than the legacy turrets. I too hope for more difficulty though.
As in better AI and more puzzles, requiring different tactics and more thinking. Not bullet sponges and overpowered (unbalanced) NPC weapons.
Agree except: there IS a difference between a "bullet sponge" and a well armored and heavily shielded battle machine. I still need to play more but as far as I can tell (pre-assault of a Zirax facility in 12) the game is not much "harder" than it ever was (bugs aside, which of course are bugs, not features). There is a happy medium in between "Realism" and "Fun Gameplay." My supposition is that, right at this moment--and throughout the history of the games development--the NPC enemy combat difficulty has lolly gagged most of its time way over on the left hand side around "Fun Gameplay" . . . to far in fact (and too invariant from game settings) to actually BE FUN for those of us who really want a white knuckle experience. I've taken out almost every facility in this game, on hardest enemy difficulties, solo at one point or another, and at my peak of play round about version 8 or 9 I was able to tackle a low to mid-tier Zirax facility and take it out at or before Level 5, with nothing but a shotgun and a drill! (and maybe a few bandaids). Now I'm not saying all this to brag. I'm a intermediate player, and I'd get my ass kicked in either infantry PVP or shipt to ship, I just don't have the reflexes to deal with other younger humans these days. But that is the point: if an old man who is keen enough to just observe how the NPCs behave and identify gaps in their tactical behavior can manage to pull that off then it means the game is too easy . . . well, the enemy combat, and in particular enemy facility defense. Going back to my analogy: the player has found herself tossed across the vast expanses of space and crash landing on an alien planet, which might be only somewhat or very highly inhospitable (depending on player choice). Turns out she is several scores or hundreds of light years INSIDE the boundary of a high-tech alien "Empire" the Zirax, who are somehow embroiled in the disaster that got her crash landed here. The Zirax seem to know she is on THEIR planet (it IS inside their territory in Andromeda), or at least they find out pretty quickly, and they don't like it (they pretty much attack her on sight, and then start into a pattern of dispatching small piecemeal attacks on any base she builds). This does not "make sense" is what I'm saying. If they care that she is there enough to attach her, and they send one small token force that gets wiped out, then--given they are smart enough to have faster than light travel, laser guns, teleporters, etc.--they must be smart enough to realize "Oh, I guess we underestimated that pesky Terran interloper. Better get hard core on her!" and next time they'd send a doubled strength force. If that one got wiped out, then maybe they'd send a tripled strength? Now granted, we don't know for sure what their logistical situation really is on this planet where the player lands. Maybe they are stretched thin in some way or another. If that is the case, and they are short of something (ammo, fuel, personnel, intell, whatever) then sure . . . never sending out a major assault, or at least holding back on a major retaliation until AFTER an actual facility fell would make sense. In that case, they'd send a small scout force, maybe it wouldn't even attack but "kite" the player's location and harass from a distance until they were destroyed (and collecting intell). At that point the local Zirax planetary commander might either decide: (a) this Terran critter is a serious threat and throw as much force as he/she/it possibly could throw into the next attack (and also try to use the advantage of surprise etc.); else (b) this Terran critter is a serious threat and we've got insufficient reserves to properly address it = no more attacks, but beefed up defenses as much as possible. This would be a more engaging, believable, realistic and fun approach, though perhaps the current algorithm of routine recurrent Zirax suicide attacks could also be retained as one of the possible tactical decisions in one of the dice rolls. Basically, the devs should set up a conditional that fires after some event sparks Zirax recognition of the Terran's presence on the planet. Give it maybe four possible initial outcomes: 1. No action, intell is not trusted. 2. Immediate scouting force sent, with subsequent inclination to respond as quickly as possible with overwhelming force. 3. Immediate scouting force sent, with subsequent inclination to adopt a defensive posture and call for off-planet reinforcements. 4. Immediate all out attaack. In the case of (1) being the dice roll, then the dice roll would get rolled again at another milestone that would alert/remind the Zirax (could be one of the story chapters or whatever). Basically . . . the player might be expecting an attack any time which doesn't come . . . builds tension and mystery. The percentage chance for this dice roll result could be dependent on things the player has already done in game, etc. In the case of (2) and (4) then defenses at one or more of the planets Zirax facilities should be 'depleted' for a period of time (a week or a month or whatever the devs deemed appropriate). This would be as a result of the aggregation of forces (troops, transports, drones, weapons, fuel, ammo) from multiple facilities on the planet (and perhaps also in orbit) in order to mount a strong assault. Players might not like this the first time it bites them, but if this was a _possibility_ every time we played a new campaign it would spice things up. It would force (or at least incline) players to be more cautious and careful about when and how they set up their first base. In the case of (3), then defenses at one or more (perhaps all) of the planetary facilities should be beefed up, even though the player would experience much less in the way of attacks on their own base, at least for a period of time. There are LOTS of frankly very simple ways that these algorithms could be tweaked and variegated to produce a truly engaging experience, and then the issue would be simply tuning the values and making sure that even with the "overwhelming" force attacks there was some chance for a player to prevail.
You can attack almost any POI in the game in light armor and a t1 shot gun, assault rifle, sniper rifle, and some bandages.
It is difficult not to agree with the reasoning above. I, of course, repeat many thoughts. In any case, my thoughts are on this: I have always wondered how zirax would know of my presence, unless my core was telling them via a secret channel. Zirax must have scouts. Then, what is the purpose of sending drones, or a couple of kamikazes-zirax, if my core and base are hidden deep underground, and only the turrets stick out? This reminds me of the old story with "farming pirates" in elite: dangerous in asteroid fields - you fly into the field, wait - and they always appear one after the other to die. My guess is that zirax will find out about you after you appear on the radar, in your first transport ship, or after you kill a couple of their scouts near your base. Attacks should be based on the characteristics of the player's base - if it is built above the ground-zirax does not risk the lives of soldiers, and sends drones while there is. It doesn't build new ones, but rather redirects existing ones that guard the points of deposits. If the base is built underground, the infantry is sent, landed near the entrance and tries to storm it until they get to the core. This implies different principles of base defense - either ground turrets or internal guns. In the end, zirax runs out of soldiers, there is a reserve in the defense, and they go into a blind defense. You do not need any periodic attacks. You actually need two or three POWERFUL, quest attacks, after a long time of preparing the player for this, or zirax. This will also change the gameplay in the direction of either stealth passing, or focusing on firepower. However, this assumes that Zirax has at least some AI, and minimal ability to navigate, which is currently not observed. So far, all that makes them dangerous is the player's problems with reloading weapons... Some meaning could be given to this situation if Zirax and the player had DIFFERENT weapons and ways of fighting. For example, Zirax as a high-tech race, concentrate on energy weapons with a small range of combat, but huge power. The player has kinetic weapons. In the beginning, I defeat the drone base by blasting from the inside - I make my way underground, mine until the shield is breached, then attack from the inside - this is a meaningful way of guerrilla attack, from which there is no protection (they're not ready for this, so a small garrison/panic, etc.).
Very true, If you are good at aiming. Everyone says "Head shots". I'm new to the game and need more practice. I try to but when you get 3 Nightmares attaching you and you are blasting away with your shotgun its virtually impossible the minute cross-hairs, never mind trying to get a head shot. My old eyes are not up to it.
