I like the game but what I don't like at all is how people spend most of their time farming materials with shitty placeholder ships in order to spam offline made stuff or they are offline building said stuff in creative. It doesn't feel as survival to me. I would like a server where everything was built online. Where can I find such servers? would be good if you can add a way to filter out blueprint enabled servers in the browser.
You can I've been on servers that have some starter worlds blue print disabled. That said I build a ton and it is fun to build simple starters on planets but for bigger projects you need the tools in creative. Would take months to build a class 25 plus project without creative mode tools. Can't add those tools to server though would be too broken
You can only ask/try yourself through...I can't see a single Server owner who would forbid the community to spawn in their most beloved Constructions if not by Size-Class Limitations. OR make your own Server.... I build most of my Vessels and Bases within Single player/Survival. Only those Ships which need abilities which only Creative grants are done in a Creative Game. After that I collect stuff with rather 'shitty' vessels (which have been created once in Survival too).
Since people would be forced to nuild online in an actual real survival setting it would improve lag and performance since you couldn't spawn these insanely big and detailed ships. I would like it to be a survival experience and not a spaceship pageant show.
I agree that past some limit it becomes ridiculous to have a Princess of the Caribbeans type CV for tourists, with vast empty rooms, pools and fountains, and tons of guns on the outside. My idea of a starter scenario is rather radical, since I would not even allow players do use any kind of core until much leveling up, and they would only be able to grab existing ships/ wrecks and repair/ upgrade them. I don't care for bases and the number of structures can be limited on a playfield anyway. The reason to use such a radical setting would be to allow players to familiarise themselves to how ships behave, how to place blocks, the basics, in a half-baked setup. Player is prisoner/ stranded, gets to a safe POI, explore a bit, get some basic info (no silly spider swarming on the 1rst playfield), see a ship which requires a few repairs, get to learn how to mine and repair the ship, get it to work, then use it to get to step #2 which would be a POI with a few enemies, locked in until step 1 is completed. Player has learned the basics, so now he can leave the planet or stay but there would be nothing more to do apart making holes everywhere. Playfields would also be pretty much like in real life : desert and boring, apart from specific spots. Topography would also be more contrasted, with steep cliffs and flat areas, to allow using HV in a fun way instead of forcing players to fight with bumpy random terrain and weird behaving HVs. This would also extend the life of the motorbike, because starting on a default temperate playfield with trees and rocks everywhere is not very fun with how the motorbike steers. Flatter starter world would be made just for that. HV are actually pretty fun (if not a heavy tank) when the terrain is made with HV in mind, and not just a bunch of topographic features randomly thrown together. Like another player wrote today : spread the content instead of cramming it all in each playfield. Better for performance, and better to keep players motivated and moving around. Players are way too focused on mid and end game right from the start, so there's something missing in the first hours/ days of play. New players can feel the gap when they start the game for the first time, and it is a crucial moment for feedback. If we had some way to do this, I would even put the whole preamble/ tutorial before the descent in the escape pod on the 1st real planet.
Personally I do not like the invisible auto-build instant spawn mechanics in this - despite that it takes time. TBH - I have always liked the blueprint based build system in space engineers (manual/auto welding from a projection or with a mod, 'nanite' based welding of a projection). I should also think that with the invisible build, it is awkward for PvP as there is no means to trash a vessel or structure that is under construction. At least a newly spawn vessel is pretty much useless until it is fueled, ammo loaded and the shield warmed up I guess and it takes ages unless fed with components. As for the OPs comment - there is no game config mechanics for what you ask in game, however you could edit all of the playfield files to disable spawning. This does not disable feeding the factory and buiding in the factory, it just disables to ability to spawn a resulting build. In project eden there are some starts that prohibit spawning in the starting playfield and there have been times when I have though that maybe spawning should be prohibited on the starter planets and maybe their space playfields too or maybe even the entire starting solar system. At the start is is no big deal to hand build stuff. OTOH, some of my end game vessels? Erm - it took long enough to make them in creative and building them in game block by block would be a nightmare for various reasons, many being to do with how laborious hand building (and tear down in particular when you changer your mind) can be in this. I also think that hand building larger more complex structures/vessels is something that really only very experienced builders could take on - the kind when given a vessel size/mass tier and function will know exactly how many thrusters, generators etc are needed, what tier(s) it needs to be and exactly where to put thrusters etc and that is something I think you only get a good feel for after you have done a lot of builds and maybe made alot of mistakes along the way. Forcing this on less experienced players might actually scare them away without creative tools. Of people I play with, I am the only real builder and the rest can cobble some blocks together, but really it isnt their thing or their build are really fugly barely functional bricks but they can at least try to enjoy the rest of the game using my builds or other workshop builds. The build system in this definately needs a complete replacement however and I think eleon should have a look at projector based (and repair) building in space engineers when running the 'nanite build and repair system' mod for inspiration. Maybe also look at how salvaging works with this mod too as I think salvaging is mostly too much of a pain in the ass to bother with in this.
Completely agree with this - the current tech progression is a mess to the point is just makes levelling a grind once you have a warp capable CV as most of us by level 10-12 are only limited by what we can unlock and having mined the resources as we have already discovered everything resource wise and have the means to access it. I also think the current level based unlock should be scrapped completely and instead have some of the unlock automatic based on what you have already built like in space engineers for basic stuff) while more advanced equipment has to be discovered through exploration / looting / trade and may require travelling to the space of a certain faction etc (kind of like advanced cores in legacy space - except you aquire an unlock rather than the item). Maybe salvaging should have a part to play in unlocking. Recipes need to change as well to allow (for eg) at least erestrum zarcosium and maybe even gold to be pushed out of the starting systems entirely and yet still allow a full current tech level 10 CV/BA (up to current T2) or level 12 HV/SV to be made (up to current T3). Use platinum for T3 CV/BA extender and T4 SV/HV perhaps and find uses for aluminum and maybe add some other ores too etc to extend the tech progress and allow it to be spread around in a meaningful way. Maybe add some kind of exotic material harvesting from different types of stars and gas giants etc?
Agree. It just takes away from the survival experience. If you knew someone built some scare looking huge ship in-game, now that would give you respect and make you think that guy is smart and a veteran. However as it stands when you see a huge ship it's just some kid that farmed a ton of resources to spawn it. As it stands there's no incentive to learn how to build at all. With the right in-game tutorials one could learn how to build within the server once you reach a safe place. In Minecraft people build insane redstone systems ingame in PvP servers since you can't spawn anything, and when you find these people's bases you are impressed since you know these guys are smart and not just spawners. Same principle should ap You could also be caught while working by enemy factions which is part of real survival in the dangers of space. It improves the whole PvE and PvP experience. People would be always online and not offline building. It would also help with lag as it would get rid of unnecessarily big and detailed stuff.
I don't think it's possible to have cookie-cutter solutions that fit both singleplayer and multiplayer adequately, without one being unbalanced relative to the other. I think that constant hesitation as to what the game should favor only resulted in being sub-optimal for both groups, unfortunately. Quests work fine in singleplayer, but it's not possible to contain a group of players and force them down one corridor and have them all flip the same switch at the same time. Same problem for resources : if just enough to be right for singleplayer, multiplayer will not work because lack of resources, etc. Sure, with very "generic" content and not much care for balance, it's still possible to have a setup that feels relatively adequate for both, but that leaves a great part of the game's potential behind. Until we get a clearer idea of what main parts of the game are still due for a big change, there's not much we can do without risking throwing days of work in the garbage at some point.
I don't see why not. In 7 Days to Die I had no idea what I was doing, and I learned how to build pretty much everything online in a PvP server doing the different quests. It tells you what stuff to gather and how to build it and slowly unlock new recipes. It could be the same here. Teach you "gather X", once you've found these materials, it tells you how to build a simple stuff, then you unlock more complex stuff and slowly keep going. You could have a grid projection thing that tells you where to place the blocks for the tutorial. Once you have understood the basics then you can get creative and expand. Starmade game I have also never played single player and learned how to do the stuff online (it's a Minecraft looking version of Empyrion basically)
Sure, but that's not a "game" as much as a "building simulator". When I mention the game potential left behind it's precisely that. If the game was just about building stuff and shooting random enemies then they could have stopped development 4 years ago.
Well - beyond that which has been stated very recently for 1.5 onwards, I think we can take it as given that everything else in this that may be considered broken is here to stay in its current broken state. As for solo vs mp - actually I think CPU and device limits might be the things that really killed any chance of equalizing as they are the mechanisms that prevent you from using more resources to build something bigger, better armed, or multi-role (armed miner because there is no-one to fly escort for eg). There was non of these limits in SE, so when playing solo - what I could build was governed by what I had unlocked and how long I could tolerate searching and mining for the resources and how much power I could deliver to it. In co-op, those same resources are shared by all, so we tended to build smaller and more specialized and a bigger base was needed. I found that to be a perfectly good enough equalizer between solo and co-op, especially with some other settings to speed up mining when alone and the fact that I could build a bigger miner etc because no silly limits. Another related thought re progression comments: Being free of level based unlocks (ie the SE unlock system) is something else that I found to be a useful equalizer between solo and co-op. I use to build my first 1 drill miner very early in SE. Even if there was 6 of us in a group - at that stage we really are not going to be building more than a couple of 1 drill miners between us. In this however, typically by the time I have go to level 7 to unlock miners and been mining with my finger nails until that point - I can build a maxed out T2/L7 miner and would never usually consider making a tiny 2 drill miner instead (unless on a very resource constrained start+options). Another example of the systems in this being possibly detrimental to a smooth natural progression.
I tend not to be too pessimistic in that regard. Their latest annoucement may have been vague, they can still pull out a feature that no one seems to consider exciting at first, but ends up a game changer. That's my modder's bias speaking, of course.
I build even the biggest ships in survival, putting them together piece by piece and having to keep everything accessible throughout the build is part of the fun for me.
It is a survival experience where building is part of said survival experience. Imagine that in 7 Days to Die you could log off, build your bunker offline in creative and then spawn it online. Same thing applies here. It's about the whole package without having to divide it between offline (creative) and online (survival).
I would hate to have to design every ship in survival, never mind having to build it from scratch each and every time. That would be awful. As an option it already exists so those who wish to play without blueprints can do so. There's a reason it's hard to find a server with that setting though: most people won't like it. However, yes, the factory does need to be reworked.
That's not what I'm talking about, I already agreed on this. When I mention that there's no cookie-cutter solution that can work for both single and multiplayer and at best it would leave large parts of the game potential behind, it's because (repeating here) the game is not just about building stuff and killing random enemies. There's a system of leveling up, quests and rewards, reputation, and the moment these can not work for groups of people, progression is not "shared". Same thing for switches/ motion detectors : if something has to happen in a POI when one player flips a switch (ex. he gets trapped inside) and there are other players outside, the "trap" did not catch them. That is why I wrote that the game is not just about building stuff and killing enemies. Also note that most players see more problems when re-starting the game several times, because there is no more surprise effect. This is worse in multiplayer for players that jump from server to server trying to find one suited for their playstyle, because they start anew each time. This introduces a biais in perceived problems with the game. I had fun buiding all by myself in my first playthroughs (broke many limbs falling down too) but after the 10th New Game start it becomes a bit tedious. Obviously, players on server may have already gone through this "discovery fun" phase and now they want to explore other aspects of the game and don't see hand building as much fun anymore. That still leaves a wide gap between spawning a small ship and a Princess of the Caribbeans blueprint out of the blue. We do manipulate CV devices out of thin air, like the big blue thrusters that can be as big as a small ship, so I guess it's a very subjective matter here as to what could be "appearing out of thin air" without completely breaking immersion.
Building ships in survival makes ships actually feel meaningful. It's way too easy to just vacuum up whole asteroids in less than a minute and be swimming in resources, so when you use the blueprint system for capital ships getting them doesn't feel like an accomplishment to me anymore.
As long as you guys don't force it on everyone else It's OK, but if it would be the only option I strongly think the game would loose 90% players. If you look how much is downloaded from the workshop there are loads of people who like to do so. I just dont get why some minority always is loudly promoting how they feel a game should be played (and changed) instead of just making a server/mod where they can do just that without forcing it on others. (its the same but worse with the pvp croud). Listening to those who shout the loudest often leaves the majority behind, and might even lead to the downfall of a project. You want to play without blueprints? fine do it, but don't force it on me or everyone!
