I stronly agree with most points @Aernoud made, though regarding XP cap, if it'd be introduced, I'd have to recommend making it in a way that not absolutely every type of action is necessary for one to advanced sufficiently. Surely one shouldn't be a superadvanced space traveller on account of regularly taking potshots at local fauna or mining every resource in the area, but I also wouldn't want a player to be forced to do all XP-providing activities just to get anywhere. Maybe a few things? A bit of mining and scavenging, for example, getting one quite far even if the same person shoots things only rarely and in self-defense?
- What do you think about the current system? Too easy to advance. - What could be improved? More unlocks. More logical progression. - Tech tree and unlock points? Points are too generous. - Other feedback? Hover vessel unlocks for example. Lights unlock at level seven. Doors at level 10. Really? It takes a rocket scientist to make doors and lights? Meanwhile the mobile constructor unlocks at level three. At the very least the HV tech tree needs an overhaul.
Tech and research is an excellent way to allow players to customize their characters and gameplay. in my mind the more types and levels of tech the better. Of course there is only so much the devs or us can think of, but there is a way to address better tech trees and the limits of imagination, when it comes to the branches. Allowing advanced research is a great way to do this. A player researches rifles, scopes, high powered rifles, and then sniper rifle. After that he/she can "invest" in advanced sniper rifle along a few paths. One would be increasing range, while the another increases the power(damage) of the rifle and or the ammo type (8.3mm, 12.7mm, energy bsed like laser). this can be done on all tech trees like fuel. Different sizes of fuel cells are good, but also the combination of elements to create better cells like the fusion cell. But advanced research could allow a player to dedicate themselves a bit to a particular cell, making it better than the out of the box version. Or a complete new branch (renewable energy) allowing for the creation of wind, water and solar power generators, and the ability to store that power for remote use like on ships. Construction tech could allow players to invest in tech that reduces requirements, or that speeds up construction of items. this can be further branched off into research that speeds up the processing of individual ores as separate lines of tech. Another possibility would be substitution Engine tech could branch pout into faster speeds, more efficient thrusters/ propulsion, more powerful engines and smaller engines. Imagine being able to research the 3.7.3 thruster down to a 1-2-1 size, and reduce its power usage as well! My CV uses so much power, I have a hard time keeping it fed Ship board O2 generation would be great, and the ability to take the helmet off while on your capitol ships. Of course with all of the expansive research possible not to mention the enjoyment of micro customization available to players, the unlock points currently in use would not fit the bill. Instead you would need to have a new module for the base/vehicles (probably restricted to bases and CVs) specifically for the purpose of research. Research would then be time based versus level based. Which should be fine as XP currently only opens tech and grants unlock points, instead of the current system, a system is needed where techs require a certain number of tech points (credits if you like). Researching each advance would cost a certain amount of points, that is generated by the research station. Additionally if you like you could add additional tech points for each level attained. In this type of scenario, a player would have to learn to do everything before they could actually do it. Basic stuff like building a hut to survive would be standard, but building a real base would require learning how to make concrete or steel. Each piece of the base and all of the permutations of that item (shapes, sizes, textures) would be a separate thing to learn. Ship building would also become a lot more entertaining, as you have to research each aspect of the ship (similar to the way it is now) but each of those techs could be expanded to allow for bigger capacity, lower weight, and advanced research to allow for almost unlimited progression if the player wants it, and is willing to invest the tech points to get it. I think it would be nice to progress the character as well as tech through the leveling process. Allowing players to add a certain number of points to their stats for each level would be awesome. Right now our character is the exact same at level 30 as they were when they got out of the escape pod. It would add a lot of depth and further customization be able to add health, stamina, and maybe an additional stat like fortitude to combat wounds, resist poisons and parasites, and food poisoning. Fortitude could also be used as a damage reduction system for combat purposes. Sorry for the long wind. So much potential in this game!
Im not a fan of the tech tree. That is why me and pretty much every video of other people playing the game will set the player progression to fast. I think tech should be locked by what type of constructor it is, what resources you currently have. I do love the idea of exploration and being able to unlock hidden tech through research labs. A device that lets you scan items so that your constructors can then construct those would be cool. Take for instance if I find one of those red pistols, I can then take it to my scanning device or lab and the advanced constructors would then be capable of constructing those red pistols from that point on. The tech tree would be replaced with the discovery window. It would show you all the stuff that is available to be found in the galaxy but that you havent discovered yet. This game mechanic encourages exploration. It also can encourage PVP. If a player kills you they can take the red pistol and then scan it themselves. A tech tree makes more sense to me in an RPG style game not in a survival game. That said I understand why there is an effort to not kill something that was worked on and already exists. but I honestly and humbly suggest that there is no amount of tweaking that would make the tech tree any more useful because it just does not fit in the game.
I definitely see where you're coming from with this. The primary problem I would have is that giving a player the ability to fabricate the epic weapons whenever they choose, undermines the idea of it being epic. Eventually, everyone would have one and the power curve would be meaningless. Worse yet, in a multiplayer scenario where one group has found an epic weapon and replicated it for all of their members, a less equipped team would not last long against firepower of that magnitude. If they did manage to kill the wielder and loot the gun for themselves....then replicated it for their own team, then the power curve flattens and new, more powerful weapons have to be added to the game. Then you get into a power creep scenario and it's like WoW all over again. By and large, I agree with you about the tech tree, though. From an RP perspective....it is the character who's learning to program more and more items into the constructor, or is the constructor only allowing the character to see schematics that it deems they're smart enough to know? If it's the latter, that constructor and I are going to have a serious and incredibly brief 'chat' when I learn to make explosive devices. If it's the former, it would be interesting to see the character learn new schematics from scanning downed drones or taking over a structure. One could clear out an alien base, hack into the core (ultimately resulting in its destruction) and get a new schematic which would be stored in your suit's computer systems and eventually downloaded into your constructor when you return. Through experimentation and simulation, you could refine a pistol's design and take it from T1 to T2....or whatever.
I see your point I also like your idea. But I think hat your concern has more to do with weapon balance which would be a separate issue. weapons or tools or modules can always be nurfed or buffed for the sake of balance.
The more economic (in terms of work hours of development) is to balance things to begin with. Having to adjust things later for the purposes of balancing shows that the base design is flawed.
I think when it comes to PVP there will always be balancing issues. Either that or you drastically simplify it which is the short and lazy route. Look at pretty much any game. You always have progression. The newer player will always have a disadvantage to the veteran player. So long as every player has an equal chance at discovering the technology it is not unfair. And so long as the technology is not extremely over powered then you should be safe.
Good points. We would also have to account for variables like someone who has a terrible network connection (not that the devs could do anything about it). But I suppose my greater point in all of this is how to prevent a griefing situation where someone gets out of their escape pod, grabs all their stuff, and within 5 minutes is being gunned down every time they respawn and try to grab their backpack. And even if they manage to team up with a group of friends and try to build a decent base so they can start advancing their tech....but there's another group, all of whom are outfitted with these epic guns, who keep destroying them before they can make any headway. 'Go to a different server' is a viable option, but it will leave a sour taste for the new player(s) who's only 'fault' is that they haven't advanced enough to be able to compete. I've spent the vast majority of the last ten years working on games, so it's sort of ingrained into me to present these scenarios to make sure we've covered all the angles as it were. And I love your avatar.
I never like the "Go to a different server" response haha The thing is that even someone with a basic assault rifle can take out someone with a fancier gun. That is how it should be at least. So this is a balance issue not a game mechanic issue. The game mechanic of discovering new technology through exploration or other methods is a good mechanic. I think it gives more reason to explore and more reason to the game in the later game. So long as it is balanced I dont see any issue though balance does need to be considered. That applies to literally every game mechanic though.
The Tech Tree is already a Band Aid Fix till the REAL System gets Implemented. ETA unknown. That's the kind of thing PvE Planets are for, to give Newer Players somewhere they can power up & to give all Players somewhere they could build a Home Base/Fall Back Base. With that said I do still understand your point. Gankers are Cowards. Dragon kind will never respect them. Also a good thing POIs can be set to Auto-Reset periodically so other Peeps can get their chance at good stuff while also still technically having to earn it.
Personally I think this whole page has slightly slided into off topic Anyways, I'm not sure how much I can contribute on this since I only play pve with a small team of friends with voip set up and mostly we're just goofing around. But at least in all the 300hours I've played so far I've never really gotten the use of the whole "experience points" thing. Same with gun limitations on the ship(s) or limiting players from leaving the planet it someone stays behind. I do understand that in some cases there needs to be server side balance for pvp scenarios, but those should be left up to server keeper not imposed as standard. In survival game what should limit your constructs is how lazy you are, not some artificial limits. Ie, how much materials you can be arsed to mine to actually craft something. When I get into new survival game I don't want to spent first day just clearing same silly enemy bases, killing drones and bad AI aliens until I've got enough XP to unlock the thruster I need for SV or mine gazillion blocks of iron just to get that darn plant pot into base, when I usually use less than 1000 iron ingots in my usable fleet whole game Same goes with handheld weapons, yes it might be nice to have people "specializing" into one branch of weapons, so that one guy will be the sniper for the team, while one other will get the minigun and so on and so forth. That I suppose is why the whole tech-bush thingy is in there, aside from the fact that as soon as you can start building SV's hand weapons are pretty much 100% pointless, so there's no need at all to do branching in there either So why bother with all that tech-tree stuff? Why enforce the "player progression" at all? At least personally I love the aspect that you don't actually need to level or "choose class" when you play this game. Just get in there, explore, build some very weird ****, explore more, crash, die horribly, rinse and repeat. The "progression" comes quite naturally when you get your designs working and start to move from colonizing one planet into colonizing the whole planetary system, making different bases, different ships for every situation so that you can adapt according to the environment. Understanding what and how to build sustainable "life" for long time and in where, is where the true player progression is in almost all survival games, at least for me. What more do we need?
Is there a logical reason why a headlight requires the player to be such a high level? This forces any blueprint to be more difficult for early starting players and also leads to flying around a lot in the pitch dark. I'm not sure, but I think the headlight predates even the automobile, so um, not sure if that is food for thought enough. I feel that a vehicle headlight (spotlight) shouldn't really be that hard for the player to unlock or be put into a blueprint in my opinion. I don't like having to omit them from my early game blueprints I've uploaded to the workshop. I don't think it should be that high on the tech tree personally. I just want to see, and I don't think I should have to level up to whatever it is, level 5 or level 7, whatever, to make a headlight. Thank you for your time.
Maybe it's so players can experience night in the game and appreciate it as an aspect of survival? If you're powering up your shiny new HV and blasting through the darkness without a headlight... you've made a poor life decision. I'm thinking it's also along the lines of why you can't build a CV immediately upon exiting your escape pod. Suit lights, weapon lights, work lights... all allow players to see at night while they advance tech enough to outfit their vehicles with headlights. As difficult as it is to NOT be able to see, it does add real importance to lighting in the game, which most games up and ignore. Even with all the push-back, Eleon seems to be determined to make night matter.
Leveling up and Tech Trees might be okay for a singleplayer survival run, but having tech trees and levels serves no purpose in multiplayer. Its just an annoyance, and everyone will just find the fastest way to level up and grind them out to get it over with so that can actually have fun and build things.
Please Multiplayer is so broad a term player vs player Battle Royal player vs player , with Sanctioned battle grounds team vs team team vs environment team vs team, with Sanctioned battle grounds and others As it stands right now I do agree with you. Especially if you refer to PvP Co-op Multiplayer could use a leveling and tech tree system. The current system would need to be replaced though Level could effect gaining Player Skills/Traits Tech could be more of a research based form. This would promote Cooperation and team play. Even more so if any one person could not learn every thing. This could work in Team based PvP as well if proper team based mechanics were build. As it stands right now we have a mob of one man armies.
I'm am biased to co-op team play-style, I sorry if i made it sound that way. There nothing wrong with a one man army. I would just like to see different play styles be allowed. Currently the game really only does PvP Battle Royal, Factions tend to be in name only.
Ahh, in that case I can agree, as long as I can be a One ManDragon Army if I so choose. & as long as I can have powerful Warrior Vessels powered by my fondness of Mining that can power the expensiveness of all that Brawn on said Vessels.
