How much better do CV shields get? I have the Advanced I think it is with 20k hit points, but it really doesn't last long at all, nor recharge particularly quickly. I rarely get to the really late-game stage where I can build / spawn from Factory any of the uber CV's, plus I prefer to build my own, very very rarely using anything else. So, perhaps my designs suck, but they're far from entry-level CV's. For me, it's the balance between what damage I can deal (very low) vs. how much I can take, which isn't much even if a POI has just one Laser Turret. If my CV could take more damage / shield recharge was better, and of course turrets actually started shooting promptly then I'd have less issues. Being able to take on a low-level - no more than four turrets - unshielded POI in a pretty heavily-armed CV should be a better balanced engagement, but it's not. Like I said, I will experiment building a more combat-oriented CV, using Combat Steel and being less reliant on shields. Plus I'll give it Cannons over Miniguns as I understand they're better vs. Bases / other CV's. Note: I do all my building in Survival as part of the gameplay, I don't really design stuff outside of that. As such, my builds are based on what I can scavenge more often than not, and far from optimal builds. Scoob.
Ammo Controllers don't need to scroll. They're meant to hold ammo, of which there are only a few variants so no need for hundreds of slots. Cargo Controllers: They have the scrollable slots. If the other controllers did, not a single person would use the Cargo Controller and it would be just one more wasted block ID.
Well, that's interesting... I built a CV specifically to take on ground-based POI's. It has ten Cannon Turrets positioned so they can all fire on a given target if positioned correctly. I got short on Gold during construction, so it has one less Improved CPU Extender than planned. Because of this, it just has the regular shield (12,500 hit points) rather than the more advanced (20k points). I took it up against a POI with three Laser Turrets and one Missile Turret - this was the same POI that forced my other CV with 20k shields to retreat, as the shields were taken down quickly. However, with the lesser shield, this new CV has been able to easily tank the damage. This is not purely because it can take down the POI's turrets more quickly, though it can, but rather that the shields simply don't appear to be dropping as fast. I fully expected to lose shields during this encounter, especially as I have just 12.5k hit points and my other CV's have 20k. This is why the new one is made of Combat Steel, so it can continue shooting even when shields are lost. I'm quite amazed that I did not lose shields. In summary, same POI, my CV had less shields but it was never in danger. Shields did not drop below 90% the entire time! I'm thinking I must have a different POI by mistake, one with lesser armaments than before, but it's the same Drone Port that's very near a hovering "CV Primus Freighter"that I plan to hit next. On my 20k shields CV, the shields dropped fast, worryingly so, causing me to retreat. With this 12.5k shields CV, they dropped to 91.4% at their lowest - and that was me deliberately entering LoS for all four turrets. I'm a little confused! Going to try more POI's with this new CV. Do the 12.5k shields recharge faster or something? Stats suggest they do not. Edit: as a sanity check I brought my 20k shield CV close to this POI. The POI is now down to just two turrets (correction, it had four Laser Turrets, one Missile and at least one Sentry) as I was going to leave the last two as they did not have LoS on me after I landed. I flew the 20k shield CV in, right over the POI so the remaining two Laser Turrets could shoot it and my shields were approaching 90% within a few seconds. This is darn weird! I might remove the 20k shield and replace it, though the 20k shield on my other other CV was also falling very quickly vs. low-level POI's. I can see what's happening, but I cannot explain it. It's been a long session, so perhaps something has gone screwy? Scoob.
RNG hates me lol. Why resource meteorites are constantly landing in deep water for me, this means my excellent little SV Miner is useless. Thought I'd been a little more lucky this time as the meteorite landed in relatively shallow water, so while I couldn't fly down to it (I miss SV submarines!) my drills could reach it. However, they don't operate when submerged. Argh! lol. Back in Alpha there was (vanilla) talk about water vessels able to operate under water. While there's not much else to do under water - other than collect plants etc. on foot - it would be useful to be able to go under water in a vessel to more readily snag these resource meteorites. Is this something possible via modding / scenarios? Is there any way to add perhaps a different kind of thruster to work under water? It would be cool, more generally-speaking, for the under water aspect of the game to be expanded on, as was hinted at during the Alpha. Note: environment on my current planet is exceedingly hostile (hot, lots of rads) so there likely shouldn't be liquid water anyway...of course I'm assuming this wet-looking stuff is water lol. What I'm saying is, with my current equipment levels, I need to be inside and use the Drone to mine. Seems a shame when I have vessels that are great at mining...outside of water. Scoob.
Well, I certainly can't fault your logic, and agree (Well, this ONE time ). Seriously, makes total sense. Sorta. But here's something thing that doesn't make sense. Why have Ammo and Harvest extenders at ALL, it's just a pair of wasted Block IDs? Hear me out, please, try to keep an open mind. I can totally see it on a CV where you might have a design that needs incredible amounts of Ammo (although I doubt most huge CV's are used so much for Harvesting, they're inevitably weapons platforms). Then, yes, you might need a Ammo extender. Harvest? Hmmm. Not so sure about that, as you say, not so many items. But it's a different story for an SV or an HV. An SV by it's nature is an {ahem} small vessel, same with HV. (Remember, open mind please) I think you have it wrong here. When players are building HV's & SV's 90% of the time they're resource strapped (especially in RE). Being forced to add another controller to ship that has TWO extendable controllers already just doesn't make sense. Not to mention the giant PITA that managing to arrange them and the extenders to not touch each other in a tiny cramped space ... So I would argue that for a CV it makes sense, but not for an SV or HV. By the time a player gets to CV building adding a couple addition controllers is trivial and there's plenty of space to arrange things. So, I get your point, and even agree to the logic for CV's, but it just doesn't translate well to HV / SV based ships where every block and tiny bit of ore counts. Again I ask, on an SV or HV why would the controller extensions even need to exist, and how much does it cost you do re-enable scrolling on them? Perhaps you'll ponder this and re-enable scrolling for the small vessels. --------- I've long used my Ammo and Harvest boxes to help organize my loot. I was taken aback when they got full and didn't scroll despite having lots of storage left. In my defense, not my design, I always used Cargo controllers for my loot boxes but this "The Mole" obviously needs some changes to be RE ready. Sigh, I just got the engines and interior all rearranged to allow T3, Now I see I'll have to add a Cargo Controller and split up the extenders. I do hope you realize you're warping my brain with RE. I'm sending you the Psychiatry bills. Including travel expenses. {Sheeze, a guy FINALLY starts to get a handle on this damn complex game and you have to change it all. The nerve of some people.} Cheers! And thanks for such a great upgrade to the game!
Hiya @Thor'sHammer .. when the weight & volume limits are enabled the extenders increase the volume capacity vs. total # of slots. In relation to CG the weight is all concentrated at the controller (actually the origin corner of the container block) regardless of how the extenders are arranged. Also, when they are destroyed the ammo controllers actually explode (regardless of contents or lack thereof) causing area effect damage. Without extenders and with volume limits enabled the harvest controller could only hold a couple hundred units before you started ejecting ore.
Thanks for this, I wasn't aware of some of that, I'll have to ponder a bit on how this affects my position ... So are you saying there's NO scrolling with Vol/Mass turned on? Not sure that's true. I think RE sets different rules for Harvest and Ammo controllers. Definitely didn't know the CG info. I've modded a lot of ships but I have two left hands when it comes to building one myself, I failed Drafting class in school . Just don't have the gene. Many talents, that ain't one of 'em. I can totally mod an existing design, matching the theme, and have done a bunch (never published) and would like to think I improved them That CG info explains a LOT and will be in my modding toolbox for sure, thx. Who knows, one day I'll take the plunge and actually build a ship from scratch. Think I'll start with a 50 turret CV. How hard could it be?
Just saying that extensions don't change slot count- the scrolling or lack thereof is dependent on how many slots there are, so ammo still fixed and various cargo potentially have scrolling to handle more than what fits on a single page. Actually the mass being centered on the controller makes it easier as you can control the CG by controller placement. This can be pretty critical with an HV- if you locate a harvest controller on the back for example and your rear hover engines are in front of it you could find yourself tipping nose up as you mine into the controller. The main thing to remember with CG in the post-RCS era is that the vessel will tend to rotate around it and your control authority is based on how far away the thruster is from cardinal X/Y/Z lines running through the CG- a thruster that is on that line can add to velocity in that direction but one that is offset can also add torque. Having thrusters that look like this on the back... [T] ---- [CG] ---- [T] ...lets you yaw the ship. The bigger the thrusters and/or larger the offset the greater the degrees/second you can turn.
Since there seems to be some confusion: Ammunition Controller (HV/SV): 8x8, 64-slot standard full page window. Harvest Controller (HV/SV): 8x8: 64-slot standard full page window. Container Controller (HV/SV): 8x16: 128-slot maximum scrollable window. (Generic storage) Ammunition Controller (CV/BA): 8x8, 64-slot standard full page window. Container Controller (CV/BA): 8x16: 128-slot maximum scrollable window. (Generic storage) Harvest Controller (CV): 8x16: 128-slot maximum scrollable window. The CV Harvest controller must retrieve component parts from salvaging and mining. This includes stone, electronics, plates and ores in much larger quantities than an HV/SV is capable of due to the difference of volume vs stacksize and individual whole blocks. A wrecked CV for example will give 8+ stacks of both steel plates and titanium plates. Your average HV can't hold that much volume even with a fully-expanded controller. It certainly wouldn't be able to move. If you're playing with Mass/Volume off: Your opinions are invalidated since these systems apply only to people playing the game as intended. stick down a plain cargo container. It's 1x1 and holds 128 slots. The Large Harvest Container (HV/SV) will be increased from 64 slots to 128 in 1.6
On that topic, did something change regarding thruster placement and turning ability lately? I did one of my normal designs a short while ago, with four left/right thrusters, two near the front and two near the rear, to benefit from the torque they provide. However, it simply did not work any more. I had to add an RCS for anything to work, zero ability to turn without it. I use to be able to turn my vessels without the need of an RCS. Of course, they were better with them, but it wasn't needed - ideal for low CPU budgets. This is no longer working for me. Note: I'm talking a very early-game, basic HV so saving that RCS budget would have been worth it...if it actually worked still. Perhaps I'm getting vanilla / RE mixed up, though I rarely do vanilla games. Scoob.
I hadn't noticed anything like you describe but the Elyon guys do tweak things on a regular basis. The constructor float text for RCS still says "required" but I figured that was just an oversight, I rarely use them anymore either. I defer to @Vermillion on changes he's made that would impact how it behaves in reforged & re I like the game with cpu/weight/volume but Colleen doesn't (& her opinions aren't invalid in our household ... co-op is more fun than solo for me 8^) so I only play with them on in my private game. With it off using a controller without extensions is the only way to use weapons or harvesting tools on an SV and on a CV or BA using the 1x2 old style ammo controller isn't really a value add.
Similar to how F2 factory material storage mechanism functions in the land of rubber science. If storage were predicated on teleporter tech the game balance issue could be addressed by increasing power utilization based on how much was crammed into a container- then the fuel storage and generators would end up being the critical components. The advantage of making that jump as far as verisimilitude is that there is no way you can put the big stuff that comes out of containers, controlled or otherwise, inside the boxes they fit in. No complaints here either way, you guys do really neat stuff with the product and adapting to the changes/challenges is fun. Got our a$$es kicked by the drone tech POI yesterday- the turret placement is evil!
Turrets morphing to hydroponics bug is back again Have asked my server admin to sort my ship out so I can log back in once restored but it's a damn nuisance lol
Yeah, knew the thruster position stuff, been fixing ships that the thruster position wasn't well thought out. Just dealt with one that had 12 RCS in an SV with the thrusters near mid point. Needless to say that didn't play well in RE ... Got the thrusters into the corners and removed all but 1 RCS. What a difference. But the controller thing is a treat to me, one more big tool in my arsenal.
Thanks for the breakdown. Makes more sense when you bring in the thruster requirements (well, for HV at least ) and: No, Good Sirs, I am playing as God intended, with Mass / Vol turned ON, despite having played thousands of hours with them OFF. I do occasionally RTFM. Just for giggles and all. Large Harvest heard. Plain cargo - just threw two into the aforementioned SV to help out. Thanks to all! I see you know which side of your bread is buttered, me Lad. If you had said AREN'T valid, well, I'd rather take on 50 Abominations with a pocketknife.
Feedback: The "CV Primus Freighter" POI/CV appears to have an HV shield on it. I assume this isn't intended? Also, I noticed that every true CV POI I've claimed for myself thus far is way over CPU as it has no CPU extenders. I'd have thought CV's would be a prime source of these valuable components - especially functional CV's like the Primus Freighter - but is forgivable on non-functional / shipwrecked type CV's, though it'd be a nice bonus. I know some ground-based POI's have them, but I've been unlucky thus far with them all being either under CPU, or over-CPU with no extenders. I guess the various POI's - both BA and CV - come from a wide variety of sources, so it's tricky to ensure they're all legit / meet RE's requirements re: CPU changes. Edit: looks like this CV does have two of the Improved CPU Extenders after all. That's the second time I've Cored a CV and it's shown just the base CPU allowance, only to update upon reload. Weird. Scoob.
In vanilla there is a delay, I think 2 minutes, for CPU extender changes to show in the control panel. This is so if you lose an extender in combat you have a delay before the ship just stops moving from being too far over CPU. When you placed your core down I believe this also starts that delay on the CPU calculations (since it had no core and therefore no CPU before, core is technically the first tier). So, how long did you wait before reloading is the question?
Ah, thanks for the explanation. I simply check the CPU right after placing my Core, see it's showing the base value and that's it. It's usually a little later, when I'm getting the ship fight-worthy that I see I have more CPU to play with than I initially did. Now, I know why this is (thanks) I'll double-check the value. Scoob.
