Build: 3135 Mode: Creative Mode: Single Player Reproducibility: Always Severity: Minor Type: Signals Summary: Any thrusters that are assigned to turn on/off with a signal switch will have zero torque contribution if the signal switch is off when either the thruster is bound to it, or when the game is loaded with the switch in the off state. Description: There is a case when you are using signal switches to control thruster activation that can result in the thruster providing lateral thrust when activated, but providing no torque contribution for rotating this ship. This can be verified by looking in the statistics panel and noting a zero torque contribution from the thrusters even though they are on. This also affects ships during game load as detailed in the steps below. Steps to Reproduce: 1) In a creative orbit game, load the attached blueprint and fuel it. This CV has 4 engines, with two facing forward and two facing backward. You should be able to move the ship forward and backward and rotate it side-to-side. 2) Now bring up the control panel. There is a custom signal switch labeled "Thruster Power". Verify that it is off. 3) In the Signal Logic tab, assign all four thrusters' On/Off inputs to the "Thruster Power" signal. This should disable each thruster in turn. 4) Close the control panel. Verify that the thrusters are off, and you have no lateral or rotational movement. 5) Open the control panel and activate the "Thruster Power" signal switch. You can now move the ship forward and backward, but there is still zero torque contribution so the ship will not rotate. Toggling the "Thruster Power" signal switch, the "Thrusters" main switch, or the "Power" switch does not restore any torque capability. 6) Now set the control panel to the following state: "Power" on, "Thruster Power" signal off. Close the game and restart it. Note that the ship is still in this broken state with no torque after you turn the thrusters back on. 7) Repeat step 6, but leave the "Thruster Power" signal active before restarting. When you restart the game, the thrusters will be fully operational. At this point toggling the signal switch or the main "Thrusters" switch will disable lateral movement of the engines correctly, though in both cases the thrusters will still provide torque so you can rotate the ship. There is likely a second bug here detailed in step 7 where disabled thrusters still allow the ship to be rotated. This is observable with any ship by simply turning the main thruster switch off. Update: I changed the language from "RCS contribution" to "torque contribution". I incorrectly use the two terms interchangeably, but I want to clarify that this is not related to RCS devices.
I can confirm this, but the behavior for fixing it was a little different. There was no a linked switch in the main control panel, the thrusters were linked to a manual switch inside the HV cockpit. In order to fix it, I had to go to the main control panel, devices and select every thruster, and disable and enable individually each thruster, while still were controlled by the switch in the cockpit. After "refreshing" the activation state of each thruster in control panel, the HV was able to rotate again, when the cockpit switch was on, of course. All this was tested with this HV: Kriel-Tengu by jrandall (jrandall if you read this, I love your designs, you are doing a great and talented job, thanks so much) https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1857821558 I do not when or how the problem was triggered, I normally leave all HVs / SVs / CVs with the thrusters off before saving the game and exiting. I see that there is no connection between the state of switches in control panel and the physicalized switches (switches objects) that we can use, and I think this is not consistent. If a device is linked to a physical switch, the state of the switch in control panel, should be in sync with the physical switch, and the inverse is true too. I do not see this sync happening, or not in all cases at least.
Hello, Here is a save game in which this issue happens. You will be inside the hangar of the Kriel Overseer. Turn to your left about 60 degrees go to the Kriel-Tengu HV, enter, press Y to power on the HV, at the left of the pilot seat, just before the seat, it is the Thruster power switch, enable it, take the control of the HV, press space to undock, you will see that you are junable to turn the HV. Now go to the HV's control panel, select each thruster, disable and enable each one. Test again, now you will see that your are able to turn. If you save the game in this situation, it will work, but... If you disconnect again the power switch on the left of the pilot seat, power the HV off, and save the game, the problem is there again after loading. The save game file: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1HmruFOLLZrXZEumsPhsmY6pL9RulE3K_/view?usp=sharing
If the thruster is off, it is supposed to not contribute, and not show on the stats page.. that stats page has been dynamic for some time. I have some thrusters linked to my landing gear to shut off, but I have an override switch to force them on regardless of landing gear (if hauling a lot of cargo). This is a feature, so you can turn on/off different combinations and check the dynamic statistics page to see what it would do for you, what change it made.
You are correct Lord Sapito. This bug is that you can get the ship into a state where the thrusters are on, but not contributing any torque. In the screenshot I posted you can see plenty of lateral thrust power indicated, but 0 rotation torque.
I think maybe you hit on the fringe a bigger undiscovered bug here. a week before 1.4 I can confirm flying into space with an cv, flying for a short time only for the cv to suddenly stop and refuse any further thrust commands or control of any kind. I was able to open P and even fire weapons and stand and sit etc but ship control was completely gone. I had to relog before the ship would move again. I wish I checked the torque now when it happened. (will do if it happens again) The point is i had all thrusters on and no thruster was generating movement which sounds similar to what you describe here. None of my thrusters were assigned to signals though and no other external switching was used and i even toggled thrusters on/off with cp to no avail. I did not collect enough data to report the issue though, was just too vague and random and only happened once in the HWS server.
Wait... why don't you simply put your blueprint with the signals already configured ? How did you configure your signals ? There are 4 options : On, Off, Toggle and Follow. What did you do ? And when you set up the signals, is the main switch for thrusters "on" ?
@Furious Hellfire so I like to play my SP game as a personal Co-Op mode (it feels more server-like in that I can't sleep, and when I exit out, the game keeps going in the background like a server)... however, the bug you described with zero thrust/torque.. I experience that one time in a brand new 1.4 game (that I'm playing now) with a small SV in Co-Op mode. I exited to the main menu, and reconnected to the co-op session.. problem fixed.. So I found lots of other bugs in co-op just like they are having in MP and on servers.. so I decided for now to start up my game in SP (non-coop) mode.. and no issues in complete SP mode.
If you're referring to my original post, then for starters this needs to be fixed for survival building or in-game modification anyway. But in my blueprint I had this pre-configured for a ship with different thruster power options, including an "off" park mode. All the thrusters are set to "follow" a signal state from the switches or a logic circuit. And it will all work fine in one case, but then if I log out with the thrusters disabled from that signal the torque ends up broken after I log back in. That's what the repro case I listed demonstrates.
Ok. Knowing how the signals logic can be flaky and forces to redo everything from scratch sometimes, I think those details are important. Knowing that thrusters are already "following" player input (WASD) I'm not surprised seeing this kind of setup being so fragile.
