Feedback Required EXP 1.8 - New Game Start: SKILLON (Barren Starter Moon)

Discussion in 'Experimental Features Discussion' started by Hummel-o-War, May 17, 2022.

  1. michael.mccawley

    michael.mccawley Lieutenant

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    The Shower block is overpowered. It will "fix" radiation and temperature problems. It works even if the base is unpowered.

    This works:
    Copper 14
    Silicon: 11
    Iron: 2
    Carbon Substrate: 9
    Wood Planks: 1

    and it works if you recycle the core out from under it

    I even saved a blueprint without the core at all. 1 wood plank, 3 carbon substrate.

    I don't think the shower should work if it's not connected to a powered base.
     
    #21
    Last edited: May 21, 2022
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  2. Pach

    Pach Captain

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    If I can make a shower at level 3, that's probably good enough. :D I'll let you know when I see it. ;)

    (and thank you for fixing the "holes" in the POI... I thought those were intentional, lol)
     
    #22
  3. ravien_ff

    ravien_ff Rear Admiral

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    This is correct and works for the armor locker as well (though less needed now that light armor doesn't need a locker).
     
    #23
  4. BushiNeko

    BushiNeko Lieutenant

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    While I am in line with and admit I love being able to craft more deco earlier ( it makes sense to me)
    It makes sense mostly because we can craft a constructor out of bubblegum and dreams, then churn out cores and weapons.. but I cannot make a bed? Or a potty?
    But in the case of just dropping the shower as @michael.mccawley (empyriononline.com) stated.. it's OP. It's not an answer to making the game challenging but not dumbed down to drop crafting level of the shower and deco that are useful in helping things like radiation.
    I feel to keep the balance nerf the shower a bit when the craft level is lowered, and yes some requirement for operation. How does it function without water anyway? It's not a sonic shower Ala' Star Trek.
    Seems resource spawning for finding / crafting items like meds is better overall for all the starter moons.
    Except Akua, the only one ' setup ' for actual survival right now. It needs nerfed if anything actually.
    Note to @Hummel-o-War | Empyrion – Galactic Survival - Community Forums (empyriononline.com)
     
    #24
  5. boolybooly

    boolybooly Commander

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    I tried a Skillon start having played the desert moon before.

    The radiation level was advertised as 1.1 in game setup (seed # 250965) but once in game it was 4.8 which is a death sentence as the radiation accumulates too rapidly for you to do anything about it. Likewise a seed showing 0.4 radiation was in fact 2.8 in game. So the game setup is not reporting conditions accurately.

    I had chosen hard food oxygen temp/rad settings and was dying of radiation poisoning soon after my first oxygen bottle was produced. So no time to get to the Opportunity. I could handle the oxygen and food but the radiation is simply not viable with starter tech available, on hard.

    There is no way to treat radiation as there are no mushrooms on Skillon as @Pach was saying nor would you expect them in that environment. Which means the recipe for antiradiation medicine needs to change so it is viable. Possibly stimulant plus fire moss scrapings.

    Would like to suggest a craftable radiation resistance suit module with value around half of the upper range of the starter planet so they can be stacked to protect the avatar. Should be craftable from steel plate in the emergency constructor. There is currently only one craftable suit mod and I think this under-utilises the suit mod mechanic, which should allow a range of useful craftable mods and then offer better modules as loot and mission rewards.

    As for the shower, I am used to it. If you wanted to change this mechanic then I would suggest a deployable shower which can be made in the emergency constructor could use water bottles as made in the oxygen generator at a rate of one per shower to reduce contamination at a rate of point one per shower. Plus a high tech decontamination unit which works like a medical healatron and needs power to completely remove all contamination.

    2c
     
    #25
    Last edited: May 28, 2022
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  6. Germanicus

    Germanicus Rear Admiral

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    There are Mushrooms and other things just not the way they looked before - >
    https://empyriononline.com/threads/...killon-barren-starter-moon.99833/#post-451754
     
    #26
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  7. Pach

    Pach Captain

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    Just mushrooms aren't enough though. You have to have the one kind of moss, and I didn't see any of it.

    BTW, your picture in the linked post? I can't see it. I see it on the page, but when I click on it to see the "small images" you mention, it says I don't have permission to view it.
     
    #27
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  8. Germanicus

    Germanicus Rear Admiral

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    May be the new Forum Rules are herefor in Place which maybe a bit odd.
    Anyway the Oinment can be made as you need only Mushrooms - Small white ones in the Nests- and Plant Protein for it

    ZR1 can be found sometimes...out of 6 starts I found it so far only ONCE!
     
    #28
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  9. boolybooly

    boolybooly Commander

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    Sorry I misremembered your post @Pach .

    Thanks for the FYI @Germanicus .

    Could not see any confetti moss scrapings myself but fire moss was available. Maybe a dev made the wrong moss available by accident.

    IMHO the take away is that decontamination and radiation treatment are essential and not sufficiently readily available on this start with high radiation conditions.

    The inconsistency in radiation for these start conditions is unusual, I guess it enhances replayability but I think the upper end is impossibly high for a hard start at the moment, however radiation in game significantly exceeds the stated radiation at the start menu, so that looks like it might be a bug which if fixed could make this start more playable.
     
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  10. Pach

    Pach Captain

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    Not to worry... I'm not terribly memorable, so it was bound to happen. ;)
     
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  11. BushiNeko

    BushiNeko Lieutenant

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    Yeah.. the radiation totally lies.
    Case in point.
    Not even close to this on actual try at it.

    upload_2022-5-21_18-3-38.png

    Okay.. pic not showing.. but it's 0.3 starting rads
     
    #31
  12. Germanicus

    Germanicus Rear Admiral

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    The range goes from 0.9 to 4.4 and is pretty much seed related and is intentional according to @Hummel-o-War
     
    #32
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  13. BushiNeko

    BushiNeko Lieutenant

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    And it lies... lies I say !
    :p
    But seriously.. the selection said 0.3 and yes.. it was 0.9. A very notable difference and while minor compared to the other things we all have been finding now still a thing. If I notice it, then it's probably going to draw commentary. :-/
     
    #33
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  14. boolybooly

    boolybooly Commander

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    Thanks for explaining that, IMHO it appears to be bugged.

    Since extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof I am providing example screenshots of a playfield with 4.8R from a seed predicting 1.1R.

    Skillon seed # 250965 start menu screeny says 1.1R.
    https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2811208930

    Screeny in game from same start shows 4.8R.
    https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2811208955

    • To replicate, make a Skillon start using seed 250965.

    4.8R exceeds the upper limit of 4.4R as well as being inconsistent with the start menu prediction of 1.1R suggesting it is a bug and not as intended.

    Even if it was working as intended, having tested 4.8R, IMHO 4.4R would be way too high to survive on "high" radiation impact settings without other mitigating mechanics which are not currently balanced for the early game. I dont think meds will be enough because they did not decontaminate last time I used them so the injury just recurs and then a bunch of other injuries follow meaning that decontamination is the only viable strategy as the ill effects of radiation poisoning were previously too punitive to recover from. Only the immunity shot was viable because that prevented contamination and that has a limited timer so you would need hundreds to complete a start without dying to the point where you could decontaminate and avoid further contamination.
     
    #34
    Last edited: May 22, 2022
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  15. boolybooly

    boolybooly Commander

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    There is another point I want to make which is I am feeling a sense of loss at the idea that the desert moon becomes off limits for sandpit play if you are obliged to go missioneering to get to the Opportunity in order to survive. I used to play that moon a lot, just dont like the idea of being forced to do anything. Wanna be free!
     
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  16. boolybooly

    boolybooly Commander

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    With a lot of practice, I have to confess I have been able to complete the Skillon start to obtaining shower in Opportunity with fast/high impact for food, oxy and rad-therm when the RND was 2.9R, though I should add I failed at 3.6 and it was completely impossible at 4.8R despite a lot of practice and optimisation.
     
    #36
  17. ravien_ff

    ravien_ff Rear Admiral

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    This is a display bug where the stats on the screen where you select your starting planet doesn't show the correct info.
    This occurs when the scenario uses a randomly generated planet in a fixed solar system.
    It is most definitely a bug and now that it affects vanilla it should be fixed.
     
    #37
  18. Pach

    Pach Captain

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    I managed it at 4.0R, but it was still rough. I had to basically beeline for Opp with everything I needed for O2 ASAP
     
    #38
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  19. Hummel-o-War

    Hummel-o-War Administrator
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    For the next iteration, the Radiation for Skillon will be on a fixed 4 RAD but with 2.2 on the crashzone, so it is only slightly above what the suit can handle .. so you only have the pressing ticker in your ears when NOT in a dialogue. Also had no real problem to get to the Opportunity and getting the meds. Also added some "resource" for anti rad meds to the starter area.

    (Maybe it is too easy now? Players should gasp to the Opportunity at best. Maybe dial up the RAD for the sandy biomes?)
     
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  20. Germanicus

    Germanicus Rear Admiral

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    Eventually in the nests? Hence there are Pentaxid and sometimes Promethium which by itself is radioactive?
     
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