+1 Iorail for the courage to express perhaps an unpopular view. if your account of the situation is accurate, i find it disturbing. i would prefer to give shannon/ skeptic a chance to address these claims, and hope he does so soon.
Iorail, I am sorry to hear that you have had a negative experiences on our server. You have however made a counterfactual statements that I feel the need to address. In the link you posted Sarge4id apologized publically to you about spawning in a large ship and we've since agreed that will not happen again, but this was clearly not intended to cause harm and ceased once it became known to be a problem. You appeared to accept Sarge's apology yet came here to pubically acuse us of raiding you (which you have no evidence for). I am sorry that exploits exist in the game, which is in pre-alpha still, but this was not done by an admin. Calling this admin abuse is inaccurate at best. Let me be clear that if you had provided any evidence at all of admin abuse I would be taking this situation very seriously. Instead you are just assuming it was admin abuse and publically claiming it to be as if it were factual. The other issues you mentioned such as hackers and griefers are not unique to our server and we actually have quite a few less of the latter than do other high population servers. I too dislike hackers but their presence on our server has directly contributed to no less than four security patches after we communicated the hacker's findings and exploits to the developers, which whom I work with to help improve the game. I am not making excuses for the hackers but I am doing my best to get them to use their "powers" for the good of the game. I have been told by more than one person that they like playing on Liberland so much that they do their "hacking" on other servers and play legit on ours (not that I approve of this, but it is a testament to how well we try to run things). The three of us have been drafting a new set of stricter rules to address the growing issues faced by all servers due to the growing popularity of the game. Finally, you spoke of "opening up your wallet" to the admins. We have just a single link on our site for making donations, do not grant favors to those that donate (as you seemed to be implying), and use every penny towards the cost of the server (which I pay for myself out of pocket). If you donated and want a refund then just request it. Our current server cost is $165.00 per month and we are getting an even better server that costs $400.00 (we had one but it turns out the game cannot address more than one socket so we are getting a different one). I hope this clarifies my position and please do not hesitate to email me directly at [email protected] if you have further concerns. Kindest regards, Shannon (Skeptic1222) Patterson
One of my favorite quotes is "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity" and I think that applies to this situation. You are of course free to continue slandering our server and accusing my admins of crimes that nobody witnessed, without providing a single shred of evidence, and to assume that your messages in chat were maliciously ignored rather than simply overlooked. I am always willing to hear about legitimate issues because I care about the game, the players, and the reputation of my server but what you're doing here is at best misguided and at worst intentionally mean spirited. You have no idea what is going on behind the scenes to address the "real" issues that are contantly changing. I even agree with you on many of the problems this game and our server are facing and it's a pity you were unable to reach out to me to have a conversation instead of making knowingly counterfactual statements about my admins on the main forums.
I havent seen anything happen on this server that does not happen on pretty much 99% of all other servers out there, I wouldnt loose any sleep over all of this, the exploits that were in the game and some that still are, are nothing new to pre-alpha games, and exploits dont require a 'hacker' to exploit. So odds are we have all played with an exploiter at some stage , not something worth loosing sleep over in pre-alpha. The Liberland server is a good fun server and I have not seen any actual admin abuse, when Im in there the admins if there on are usually quick to prick an ear up if they get wind of a hacker or exploiter on at the time, but at the moment there really is only so much an admin can do on the fly real time in-game. Being pre-alpha it does still come with some serious limitations. Thanks for the info on the dual socket CPU issue. Saved me a few grand for a few months until sorted. I wonder how the guys in the EU that have it running on a dual xeon cpu system go, wonder if they limit the playfields or if its AMD related. Odd but interesting !
If you read my second post in the link he provided to our server's forums, you will see that since our last wipe the ownership/admins have had a serious discussion. As I say in my post in that thread, we have a 1 chance zero tolerance cheating and griefing rule for pve areas. We need evidence though so we need screenshots, or the majority of the server giving testimony before we can take drastic action. However, if a player is reported for cheating or grieving they are approached by an admin and asked to stop if they are doing so. We don't outright accuse a person, but ask them to stop. If they are reported one more time and we have evidence (screenshot) as proof, they are banned. No exceptions. It doesn't matter how long you've played on the server or how well you know people. If you break the one or both of the two simple rules, twice you are banned for an amount of time. If you mess up again after receiving a ban, a harsher disciplinary action will be taken depending on the players past and last offense. We believe in second chances and like to think that most players will stop if they are reported. I find that a fair justice system. Also the fact that your base was raided is very upsetting to me. If this happened after the new policies were in place I now have the official go ahead to try and help you get back to where you were before the disaster struck. Right now, I provide this relief effort to players using the honor system which at some point will be abused. But until then, it has already helped out several players that I strongly believe to be honest based on their personalities, honesty, and getting to know them better. Skeptic is correct though when he said no admin took your stuff. Skeptic isn't that kind of person and you know that. our second owner, although he may get distracted and not see chat, would also never do that. And you should know by now that I would give you my personal belongings if it help boost your morale after something like that happening. It just so happens that a few of the players asked me if I was going to spawn in ships like I did before. I asked them if they thought it was ok and what their opinions were and what they wanted to see done. As a result of their opinions, I now play strictly survival like the other players. I mine what I need in order to manufacture BP's. It's not exactly what I personally had in mind, but it what would make them happy. I've said it many time that I would give up all my toys and play survival only if the players asked for it. A a man of my word and I try to do the best job I possibly can. The last few weeks I was struck with a really bad flu-like cold. Had a temperature over over 100 at one point, couldn't keep down food or fluids so I got dehydrated, and my cough was so bad I have laryngitis. Where was I during that time? I wasn't in bed resting like I should have been. No, I was behind the computer helping the other admin while skeptic was away on IRL stuff. I'm not trying to brag or be impressive. I'm trying to make a point: Being sick is irrelevant when it comes to my colleague needed assistance and players like yourself, experiencing demoralizing setbacks. To me, that takes priority every time. Iorail, despite the accusations you made against the admins and some of the misinformation you have given to try to make us look bad, because you were angry. If you were to come back on the server, if you haven't already, and contact me. I would stop what I was doing and have you try to remember what you lost so I could get you back as close as I could before you were raided. It's disappointing that you accused one of the two of us of dishonesty, specially me, but I don't hold grudges. And I would hope that you realize you may have overreacted a bit and apologize. Even if you didn't, I still would treat you the same as any other player on the server. I'd like for you to return to see things have and are changing, if you haven't already. I would like your faith and trust in us to be restored and for you to be a regular player again. If you are happy where you are now. Then stay and enjoy yourself. But you are always welcome back to Liberland anytime and my door is alway open if you have an issue you need to be addressed.
You know full well that you aren't being truthful with this statement. Further I just logged into Liberland and players that were using cheat engine with the admins knowledge are still playing on the server. Three weeks to the day since your players reported the cheating and still no single word from you on the matter, what gives? If there is no leading by example what is the leadership? Good work on finally removing them from your admin faction though! (Do note that when all the players see the faction with admins in it as the 'admin faction', and then members of that faction cheat/abuse/exploit, it has the optics to the players of admin abuse. So while Iorail has for some reason speculated falsely about some aspects in his post, his perception of admin abuse is apt.) As you've pointed out numerous times how Liberland works closely with the developers, have you informed them that you've permitted cheat engine to be used and therefore may not have the most ideal clean log files for the developers? Please be aware that servers such as Homeworld are automatically detecting and banning such players. Lack of tools is one thing, lack of willingness is completely different. At time of writing they are the top ranked with 25 players, Liberland has 3 and I just verified again one of the 3 is the biggest cheat culprit thus far... If it was just another server this wouldn't even be a topic of conversation, but you publicly founded the server with some specific reasons and so with that statement comes responsibility and the microscope treatment from the community. After a very short time you needed to step back from server leadership due to personal obligations (which is understandable), but the ideals you professed publicly which brought people to your server have had no follow through for the last two months. This is not specifically through any fault of your own and I'm not knocking you, but you haven't been on your server in forever and I'm sorry to say but as a result you really don't have an honest accurate view of things at all. I still hold hope for Liberland as I believed in its founding ideals, and returned when your new admin invited me back. (since then that admin has resigned) I rotate through at least a half dozen servers regularly and Liberland remains the only one without real rules and no measures to deal with cheaters. Maybe use one of those extra game keys from the devs for a second account so you can test out Liberland without anyone knowing its you and experience what people complain about. You sorta have a December/January Liberland view, that really needs to be brought up to date.
Hi Beef, I have been away due to personal tragedy and have left Liberland in IJAMR's capable hands who is now the sole admin besides myself. I've always known you to be critical (which I generally appreciate) but openly accusing me of dishonesty on the main forums is really disappointing to say the least. I would have been happy to discuss the issues with you directly but you instead chose to come here and defame my character by publically calling me a liar. To others following this thread I apologize for the unproductive downward spiral into drama and promise this will be my last response. A last note to the developers on related matters As a single player game Empyrion is great but it is in my opinion doomed as a multiplayer game. Right now you have people apparently charging server owners money to scan for cheaters, who have become as rampant as in other games like DayZ and Rust (which was always my fear). Where once an admin's job was to help players and try to ensure an enjoyable gaming experience it has now become akin to fighting the war on terror, and not a fun video game version of it either. When people like myself are about to throw in the towel that should be a warning sign that you need to do something a bit more extreme to deal with the problems driving us away. If you continue to rely on the client being honest with the server then your game is doomed, multiplayer-wise at least. I urge you to use encryption, put more load on the server if you need to but do not continue to rely on the client being on the up and up with the server like you are currently doing. I am being this critical because I love this game and think you guys can solve these challenges, once you fully realize you are at a dead end security-wise. That's my 2 cents at least, Shannon (Skeptic1222) Patterson
You're right, it was disappointing to see someone openly accusing someone else of dishonesty on the main forum. Telling them it was a pity they didn't reach out to you, when the attempts by many to reach out have been unheard. If you had left out that line there would have been no fallacy to point out, which you strangely compound by indicating you'd have been happy to discuss, when you're not available to discuss anything. I'm after all only a quick double click away from you following up with any of the issues I've raised the last few months. Your former admin was not only responsive, but proactively initiated conversations with me about my concerns. Despite us starting off on the wrong foot he made an actual effort to answer questions and inspired confidence in me that things would change and the downward spiral would cease. He's gone now, but a guy that can change my opinion from anger to inspired in one conversation is an asset. It reminded me of a huge fight I had with a neighbour as a kid, we afterwards made up and built the best treehouse ever I'm sorry to hear of a personal tragedy, as you are aware I went through the worst sort myself while running a server so I can empathize of course. Communication helps in times like those, since the only thing the server knows is that February 7th you left for 10 days and never really came back. Now it's revealed today that the server was left in someone else's hands. Tell your forum that please. You say you know me to be critical, but the only real critique I've had was the lack of communication which is the easiest to address. Anything else I've raised are valid real issues and it is only the response to which or lack of that has been unproductive as that moves nothing forward at all. At least I advised everyone that some of the cheating can be detected and dealt with and now they can go find out themselves. The cheating that Iorail suffered would not have happened on that other server. Iorail however, another player turned off of multiplayer, instead of receiving an apology for the time he wasted was argued with. Argued with using non factual information, by administration that at the time was factioned in-game with those they themselves acknowledged as using 3rd party cheats. You've aplogized calling this a downward spiral and a drama, but I won't be the only person seeing clear admin avoidance to address a real issue. The server is left in the capable hands of the one who brought cheat users into his faction which is why you now deal with allegations of admin abuse. Why no apology to the people expecting some moral fortitude? What about the people like me that followed you because of this? http://empyriononline.com/threads/choosing-the-wrong-server.3718/
Its a new day guys, and Alpha is here ! Just hours away ! Fresh start, for everyone. Live long and prosper !
