Hey @Pantera - as requested, see below; This is FAR BETTER performance than other instances I've seen (many times)... that said, while the turrets performed eventually or slowly, it does demonstrate pretty much the "best case" in most instances... often times it takes MUCH more time than shown here for turrets to "wake up"... That said, this was a fresh load, so maybe that's a factor:
@Pantera ; Here's a better example - this is a shorter clip that shows an example of totally asleep turrets... before I managed to get to the record button, I was cruising along in Zirax territory, and my ventral turrets fired at and killed a Zirax (shotgun, I think)... I slammed the reverse engines and as I came about, my turrets engaged a second Zirax... I'd say it took about 5 seconds to acquire the 2nd target and start firing. That's when I got to the record button - you'll see below, my turrets crapped completely out... the last remaining Zirax (laser) is just sitting there firing away at me - to the point that I had to disengage because he almost had my shield down! In this case, keep in mind that ALL my turrets (not only the ventral ones) are set to engage "NPCs/Players/Drones" (aka Zirax ground troops)... that's 10 separate turrets (only 2 of which on the port side which would have been out of arc) that SHOULD have fired at him:
Yesterday while playing a game in SP started after the last update in A10.2 Experimental branch. By capturing and making my base on an unknown artifact. I place 2 cannon turrets and I have the arrival of 2 drones. The turrets react a few seconds later, 5 to 10 seconds, already having the drone within range of my rifle (150m?). Before that, I build an HV from scratch. I arm it with a turret and it takes between 10 to 15 seconds to shoot a drone that I found. Until he finally knocked him down. After expanding the HV I add 2 more. And they do the same. But after having a lost weapon notice !! They loaded correctly and shoot all the targets they find correctly and immediately! Some time ago I did not use HV because of these turret failures. Continuing I can generate my "UFO CV" (it is only the shell) and I am filling it with the elements that I am looting or arming to mount it. I place the turrets and I am ready to test them. Same story ... It takes between 10 to 15 seconds to react. Posters of armament lost !!! About 4 warnings until a gatling shoots about 10 bullets and remains silent. After that, one of the cannon turrets reacted and shooting without problems knocking down the drone. The ventral turrets shoot without problems to what they find on land! My thoughts of this ... for some reason they are slow to charge or lose their ammunition load very often. Could it be that they stay in a loop doing some checking of their ammo and charge ??? That they load it then they unload it and they reload it without giving any warning of error and they begin to work when they leave the loop? Could it be that they misidentify the target by giving it another classification and do not react until they have the correct classification again? The turrets in the HV shoot predators without problems. They shoot the ground troops without problems. But with the drones they react late, as the game progressed it does not reach 15 seconds, it is less now and it is reacting ok to everything ... The CV in their first meeting reacted in the manner described, tonight I will see if I face a base in space and see how it reacts. I clarify that the only modification I have of the config file is to increase the numbers of solar panels, the efficiency of these and the charge of the solar battery.
@Pantera, this is a perfect example right here. Now imagine this was a base instead of a HV and it had multiple rocket drones all firing at it the whole time. I've seen it take over 5 minutes before the turrets wake up before. In that time the base will be utterly destroyed. There is zero possibility of us providing a game save where this will be reproducible since the act of saving and reloading temporarily fixes the issue. This has been a persistent problem in ALL game versions since at least 4.0
Yes I understand. Just having no luck actually getting it to happen. @Jacob Adjani thanks for the video. I'll reply back here when or if anything can be looked at.
I've had the same issue. It sounds to me similar to the problem I had in stationeers with programming. When running a program loop you had to use a yield command at the end of the loop so it would wait for the next server tick to loop. Otherwise it would build up and lag the server out. Seems to be a similar problem, like the longer you're in the game, the longer your turrets take to react. The turret search program is probably similarly a loop program. Just speculating.
Hey @Pantera Still having issues with my video capture (I think it's recording, but it's not.... argh...) but I did manage to capture the following re: turret issues. I remain convinced this is a "multi-cause/multi-issue" problem... the changes made yesterday regarding drawing shots seems to have made a positive impact - overall, turrets seem to be responding more often, and more quickly. That said, at least one of the original issues remains - turrets either "sleeping" entirely, or "going to sleep" after engage some - but not all - of the targets in range. The following capture shows my ventral turrets engaging an enemy off camera to the left, while I approach an Alien Bug to my right... I attempt to give you a view from the perspective of the target... it is well within range of 4 turrets, and you can visually trace a line-of-sight/angle of attack from all 4 turrets... and yet they don't engage for nearly 60 seconds (and that's not counting the "approach time" prior to my hitting record).
I hope this is understood. It can be stupid but it helps me when I program integrated circuits. In general, you can not "see" inside the programming apart from reading the program written on your monitor. But it does not always react as you expect once you run. Then I have the circuit turn on lights or send messages through a port to a PC telling me what it is doing or what they are reading at that moment. The idea would be that the turret send a message to the console with indications of what they are doing. For example 1 enemy detected. 2 Checking ammunition. 3 start of shots. 4 without ammunition. 5 looking in ammunition box. 6 ammunition found. 7 loading. 8 ammunition not found. 9 etc ... Maybe we'll see how it stays in message 1 and it does not react to more of that, or maybe it keeps a message of loading and recursively looking for ammunition. Or maybe it detects the drone or animal but does not see it as an enemy and therefore does not react. So when we find the problem we read the console and make a capture of it to send it. Since it seems that not all happens to them and it does not seem to happen when it reboots or does not happen with the saved files sent. I hope to give an idea.
@Pantera / @Taelyn - thanks for moving this, I was going to ask you to... lol... apologies, I wasn't sure where I should be reporting it. 2 things (1 further concern, 1 request): 1) Further concern: I have noticed as to turret targeting (for some time now) that HV turrets are NOT targeting enemy sentry guns at all. You can sit there for many minutes and they will not react/attack enemy POI sentry turrets that are attacking you. 2) Request: It was small group of players including myself that brainstormed with you guys to arrive at what we currently have implemented as it relates to target selection options in the CP, some years back... I was flattered and grateful to play a small part in helping (hopefully) improve the game... and because of not wanting to seem in any way ungrateful or fickle, I have not mentioned this before... BUT... Would it be possible to get "Drones" broken out into it's own target selector radio button on the CP for weapons? The current implementation of "NPC/Players/Drones" works, however, it seems to me that tactically speaking Drones are a "different animal"... For HV's specifically, you are typically engaging Drones from below whereas NPC's/Players (again for HV's, and moreso in SP) you are engaging on the same plane, or slightly above - this in turn typically will mean different weapon groups involved. In my play style, Drones typically will be higher priority targets than ground troops - they can do more damage, more quickly, if left unengaged. As a result, I would like to be able to set more powerful turrets - rockets and/or plasma - to engage drones (and enemy base turrets as well). In short, Drones tend to be a distinct target group from a ship design/weapon grouping point of view, from a target priority point of view, and from a potential threat perspective - to me, it makes sense to break them out to their own "check box".
I would strongly support/second this idea - adding additional logging function (even if only for Alpha/Beta, or perhaps even only on the EXP branch) would be immensely helpful for us to help you guys find issues and causality... I know versioning is always a challenge, and if implemented it would be wise to make it an in-game toggle (as if "always on" some of those logs could get insanely large, cause performance concerns, and even potentially cause other issues of their own). However, for those of us that sit down and start a game specifically for the purpose of testing a particular issue/aspect of play, being able to capture more of "what's going on" in real time and in a reportable format as @cmguardia points out, could make worlds of difference as to how quickly and completely we collectively squash bugs!
Other targeting options may be a subject in a future release but not for now. As for the issue with targeting I still cannot get any delay to happen.
I do not want to say how to do your work, I hope I have not offended any of the developers. It was just for help in this case. I know that you are a working machine and I see it constantly in every update and chat in this forum. They are unique! It was just a suggestion (more out of curiosity) to see what happens in the case of the turrets. I do not know Unity and I do not know its development platform (I'd love to know more). Only that always the variety of tests we give and not always reproduce the same errors in all teams and it is clear that this case is taking more monitoring as the problem of the motorcycle that turns the image of heads. Keep giving it hard and empyrion will be one of the greatest games !!! Well, it is already for me, leaving the other identical games far back on my list.
@cmguardia @Jacob Adjani Thanks for your efforts I'll update here again when I know if any logging for Turrets 'status' can or not be done.
I recently had a base attack occur, in which none of my turrets fired on any of the attacking drones, for at least two full minutes. Fortunately, the rocket drones got killed on approach before the turrets went to sleep, so only minigun drones were left to keep attacking for all that time, otherwise my base would have been severely damaged by this bug. I VERY much second this request! I've been thinking the same thing for a long time, but was hesitant to suggest it, because of how many other things I know you guys are already working on. Infantry should be an entirely separate targeting priority, from drones. Infantry can be killed easier, and don't pose as large of a threat. Thus, I've frequently wanted smaller caliber (with much “cheaper” ammunition) turrets to kill infantry with, while the much stronger turrets (with more expensive ammo) prioritize the higher-threat, tougher-to-kill drones. Along this same line of thinking, these cheaper turrets can then be placed closer to ground-level, while the stronger turrets are placed atop the structure. It all just makes logical, and tactical, sense.
Had another “incident” today. I started a new game last week, on a more difficult arid world, with enemy difficulties turned up as well. Today, five drones attacked my base, and since I only started this game recently, I do not have shields yet. Two of the drones were rocket drones, and the remaining three were minigun drones. The turrets took down one minigun drone, and then just stopped firing altogether. I tried to shoot down the remaining four drones myself, but was killed by one of the enemy rockets. By the time I got back to my base and could fight off the drone attack (my base turrets did start firing again at some point, but not until after I had died trying to fight the drones myself), my base had been heavily damaged. Had the turrets been targeting & firing like they were supposed to, my base would have taken a LOT less damage.
I’d like to add some thoughts to this topic as I’ve noted some specific repeatable behaviours. Steps to reproduce: Load in any game with a decent enemy poi with lots of guns. Enter godmode Start the test from over 1km away (so the poi despawns Fly to the poi as fast as possible (using ctrl and shift) Hover just above the poi well In range of the guns In this test it can clearly be seen that the base takes some time to become aware of you. It’s like the logic behind the assets hasn’t fully spawned in yet. In a lot of the videos posted in this thread there are a lot of assets, especially trees and the players are moving quickly in a vehicle when encountering the enemy. I believe part of the problem here is time to spawn in the asset and for the turret logic to become aware of the enemy target. Turret logging would help prove/disprove this theory.
@Pantera, picking up on what cpontin said, I had a PERFECT example for you... right up until I realized that my video capture had crapped out again, and a 20 minute fight was NOT recorded... ... lol In terms of helping to reproduce, might I suggest - spawn in a Zirax Orbital Spire, and attack it with a CV with lots of turrets (that's basically the match up I thought I was recording)... the fight was "multi-engagement", as in I flew in and sat mostly still until my shields got down to almost gone, disengaged, recharged, repeat. I found that the turrets on both sides were very "intermittent" - some would be firing, others wouldn't, then none firing, then all, then none... and so on. Thought it might help to add on to cpontin's suggestion.
I discovered something reliably repeatable today, regarding this issue. I was attacking several enemy POIs with my CV, and was able to observe this behavior with every POI I attacked. I would get within firing range of all the POI turrets, which also places the POI in range of my turrets. But as Jacob noticed above, the turrets on both sides were very intermittent. But something else caught my attention here, as I also noticed that my turrets seemed far too distracted by random Zirax ground troops scattered about the POIs. My turrets would kill a ground troop, then sit idle…ignoring the POI heavy turrets shooting me…then eventually pick another ground troop to shoot at. Still ignoring the much greater threat of the POI turrets. Getting tired of this $h!7, I would take manual control of one of my turrets, to begin taking out the POI turrets myself. When I did so, I found that a moment after I'd begin firing on a POI turret, a large portion of the rest of my turrets would also suddenly join me, firing on the same turret I was. Once it was destroyed, my turrets would once again sit idle, and eventually begin firing on ground troops again (if there were any left). If I started firing on another POI turret, the same thing would repeat, as the rest of my turrets would again jump into the fun of shooting at whatever I was shooting at, only to fall idle again once the target was destroyed. So whatever is causing this problem, seems to temporarily resolve if you take manual control of a turret and fire on the threat yourself. The other turrets seem to follow your example, but then go stupid again after whatever you were shooting at dies.
