DEV BLOG Leaving Alpha & Early Access: some clarifications. :)

Discussion in 'News & Announcements' started by Hummel-o-War, Jul 22, 2020.

  1. Paulista

    Paulista Ensign

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2019
    Messages:
    13
    Likes Received:
    9
    It is beautiful, but perhaps it could use some sound effect like an engine even louder or another kind of engine sound. I know it can't be Star Wars neither Star Trek.. but the workshop gives me hope. ;)
     
    #41
  2. Israel

    Israel Commander

    Joined:
    May 8, 2017
    Messages:
    129
    Likes Received:
    133
    I wish you good luck in leaving alpha.

    I hope leaving early access helps to bring the development team into a new level of awareness on how to build a strong and fundamentally logical but fun, and consistent structure that Empyrion surely needs.

    I second this advice.
     
    #42
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2020
    ZaCloud and sulferon like this.
  3. byo13

    byo13 Captain

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2020
    Messages:
    158
    Likes Received:
    267
    Thank you, @Hummel-o-War . It was nice to see that you care and that you guys read the forums and understand all the comotion. It's only because people care a lot about the game and are so passionate to become somewhat worried about its direction seeing that there are many sci-fi survival games that gets discontinued on Steam.

    Now about the concern on the Steam reviews that I see some people posting about, I think the whole thing is flawed. Steam allows kids who don't even know how to spell to write as critics and affect ratings. Some reviews are laughable and some simpler games or games made only for lolz get positive reviews instead of many complex games like this one. There are many inconsistencies in the Steam review model.
     
    #43
  4. Brimstone

    Brimstone Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2017
    Messages:
    1,875
    Likes Received:
    3,696
    Don't dispute that for a moment, but it is the reality.
     
    #44
    byo13 likes this.
  5. Kassonnade

    Kassonnade Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    May 13, 2017
    Messages:
    4,434
    Likes Received:
    6,376
    When I bought the game it was 20$, few years ago. You bought it for 8$ this year 2020. If my calculations are right, when the game will be completed it should be free. :D
     
    #45
    Sephrajin, Sofianinho, sloe and 5 others like this.
  6. Leftcoast

    Leftcoast Lieutenant

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2018
    Messages:
    62
    Likes Received:
    59
    Not relevant, the game is not complete. Calling it flawed is the no better than calling an apple an apple.
    It by nature has flaws, that is why we report bugs.
     
    #46
    dichebach likes this.
  7. Kassonnade

    Kassonnade Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    May 13, 2017
    Messages:
    4,434
    Likes Received:
    6,376
    He's not talking about the game ; he's talking about Steam review system. ;)
     
    #47
    yataro79, byo13, RazzleWin and 2 others like this.
  8. Achilles

    Achilles Captain

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2016
    Messages:
    275
    Likes Received:
    398
    Glad they have addressed the concerns as it really did just seem so out of the blue that one couldn't help but think...

    cut and run!

    It seems like really it is just a way to re-vamp the game on their 5th anniversary which is a smart move, marketing is everything. I imagine things will continue as they always have but it does make sense from a development/marketing point of view to finally lose the 'Alpha' 'Early Access'

    the only thing that will undoubtedly happen is an influx of negative reviews on steam when new players discover the amount of bugs/issues the longer they play.

    i think as long as eleon can knuckle down and polish as much as they can as quick as they can they might be able to manage it, but even they will be very aware it's a trade off either way.

    If Alpaha 12 wasnt such a total mess i would for sure think it is a great idea and perfect timing, i just worry if new players experience what us longer term players have had over the past weeks they will be very quick to judge.

    either way i wish Eleon luck and hope for a successful launch!
     
    #48
  9. Brimstone

    Brimstone Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2017
    Messages:
    1,875
    Likes Received:
    3,696
    Yeah, but what we're talking about is potential Steam review bombing by new players who buy the game due to "release" tag and find out it has tons of issues- no matter how dedicated Eleon is to continued development
     
    #49
    Addy and ZaCloud like this.
  10. byo13

    byo13 Captain

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2020
    Messages:
    158
    Likes Received:
    267
    I mean the Steam review system is flawed.
    (Thank you, @Kassonnade )

    The way I see it there it's that it doesn't matter for the "reviewers" the naming tag, if it's EA, Alpha, Beta. The negative comments seem to be especifically linked to "the game was abandoned" or "it's not being updated anymore". So as long as there are some constant news and updates the naysayers should be satisfied?
     
    #50
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2020
  11. sulferon

    sulferon Lieutenant

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2016
    Messages:
    35
    Likes Received:
    74
    The more I think about it, the more I don't like it. In the end, the game really looks unfinished. Well, if you compare a player who played since alpha 4 and a new one, we will find that people put up with all the disadvantages, just because the game was in early access. No claim. This is normal. Thank you, Eleon, for allowing us to try this universe in its development. I have long accepted that the flight panel of hotkeys can not be assigned, or that logistics does not work with all game containers, or that the game character's hands grow out of the ass, so it takes twice as long to reload weapons than necessary, etc.. But for a new player on steam, this will all be obvious, and there will be no excuses in the form of "ALPHA" to start resenting "what did I pay money for?
     
    #51
    Addy, Kassonnade and ZaCloud like this.
  12. dispereo

    dispereo Ensign

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2018
    Messages:
    9
    Likes Received:
    6
    Congratulations!
    (And very well done on the clarification post! :) )
     
    #52
    dichebach likes this.
  13. JCataclism

    JCataclism Ensign

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2020
    Messages:
    13
    Likes Received:
    18
    I will say THANK YOU again not only for such "clarifications" (which were not necessary but welcome), but as I always REALLY like when developers announce before they make such upgrades.

    I was just about to restart a new "cheated" world game (my current savegame has become too darn heavy due to so many planetary explorations, which takes me to restart and cheat my main base and/or capital vessel into the new one). Now, I will try a little further the current savegame until the new game version arrives.

    THANK YOU!
     
    #53
  14. lendarker

    lendarker Lieutenant

    Joined:
    May 6, 2020
    Messages:
    35
    Likes Received:
    64
    What most people here said: if you release as 1.0 and leave Early Access, customers expect the game to be finished. You'll get a big influx of sales, and while most players will accept a few bugs on release day, the game could use quite a bit of polish still.

    I understand the desire to hit release day on a round anniversary. I just think it would be wiser to wait a little longer, maybe up to another year, and really polish up both the user interface; the dialog system is still very rudimentary. Sometimes text scrolls by fairly fast, especially for a non-native speaker, and it doesn't pause every screenful but goes on for two or three screens before it reaches the next button press. Most of this dialog is not captured in the PDA logs, either. Frankly, lots of usability and convenience stuff is missing or still very rough around the edges.

    From physics issues like the motorcycle getting "stuck" in terrain or starting rapid camera skipping when hitting a terrain fold at speed, to general performance issues, the very jumpy personal drone, no real tutorial and how to use that drone, and many other issues this really doesn't fulfil what the average customer will expect from a game that is released. Because the expectation is that on release, the game is finished - further expansions notwithstanding.
     
    #54
  15. Bollen

    Bollen Captain

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2017
    Messages:
    394
    Likes Received:
    359
    Ha, ha, ha, ha! Priceless!
     
    #55
  16. byo13

    byo13 Captain

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2020
    Messages:
    158
    Likes Received:
    267
    I don't know if it's related to this version but factory seems broken for some blueprints.
    I'm trying to build a default blueprint (not a downloaded one) and I'm trying to insert neodymium, cobalt and erestrum that the recipe requires. I triple checked tjat it's preventing me with "item not accepted". Is this a known issue of something new?
     
    #56
  17. Israel

    Israel Commander

    Joined:
    May 8, 2017
    Messages:
    129
    Likes Received:
    133
  18. Bollen

    Bollen Captain

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2017
    Messages:
    394
    Likes Received:
    359
    Sometimes it helps if you just move it away from the drop-box and try again... Alternatively send it to the factory via SHIFT+Clicking on the item itself from the inventory...
     
    #58
    byo13 likes this.
  19. krazzykid2006

    krazzykid2006 Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2017
    Messages:
    2,051
    Likes Received:
    2,641
    I have to ask just in case.
    Are you 100% sure those materials are actually required for the blueprint?
    When looking at those requirements in the factory does it say something like 100/0 for those materials?

    If it shows a 0 after the "/" then that isn't a required material. It's a leftover material from something you threw into the factory but isn't actually required for the blueprint.
    It will also be greyed out if this is the case.

    I had to ask because it's an easy mistake to make.
    If this isn't the case then fill out a bug report. Make sure to provide the game save and also the blueprint in question.
     
    #59
    monktk and byo13 like this.
  20. ZaCloud

    ZaCloud Ensign

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2019
    Messages:
    5
    Likes Received:
    20
    Oh boy, with so many of the new features at only placeholder status, and nonsensical changes from systems that worked just fine in the 11 generation... Goooood luck.

    Most of us have been pretty lenient and forgiving about this game's flaws so far, but that's because we were testers who knew it to be in Alpha (with the expectation that it'd eventually become Beta before release, I might add). So even though there were some rather insistent complainers, it's still been largely an understanding, patient crowd giving you guys feedback.

    But there'll be no such compunctions in a release status. Expectations will be MUCH higher, I'd say not doubled, not tripled, but 10x or higher. Because when a game is released, it's expected to be "finished, with only hopefully minor bugs that will be fixed quickly. Then cool content might get added later." But I wouldn't even come close to calling this finished. :/

    And also keep in mind that, when non-test players report bugs, they'll be expecting them to be fixed quickly and completely. Indie devs or not, that's the standard that is (and should) be expected of a game that the creators felt is ready to be considered "complete" enough for release.

    Bringing me to this subject:

    Devs (or often at least, publishers) are starting to lean too much on patches. And more and more of the gaming community is getting bitter about it. In an early access case, sure, we know we're paying TO be bug testers in exchange for playing it early (totally backwards, but at least it's voluntary)... but when there's a full release, that's not what players should be expected to do. We're supposed to just relax and enjoy a stable, completed game, then review based on how much fun we had and how well it was done. Part of the cost of the game is supposed to go to paid bug-testers who are compensated for their work and time, ensuring that the game will run smoothly, and so the player not only buys the game itself, but the peace of mind knowing that they'll get to experience that game relatively free from outside problems, able to judge the game on its own merits.

    But more and more, the industry as a whole is releasing games less and less complete, and it's REALLY bothering us that it's becoming the norm. That we can no longer just enjoy our games, but have to keep stopping due to terrible bugs and balance issues, feel all frustrated and betrayed, then take valuable time out of our lives filling out bug reports and troubleshooting (which we did NOT volunteer for when it's a release title, and are NOT being compensated for), etc, then waiting weeks to months for enough patches, so that MAYBE we can FINALLY play the game we paid for. :(

    It's NOT a norm that should be encouraged, and as a gamer, I really hope you know what you're doing, for your sakes, and those of us gamers. The last thing we gamers want to see is for this pattern to keep getting ingrained and normalized by game devs and publishers. The more they do this, the worse and worse our experiences as gamers become, to the point that me and my brother rarely purchase games on release anymore, waiting months or years for it to REALLY be finished; nearly all those we bought right away in the past 8 years or so, we've left lying around unfinished or uninstalled since we got tired of waiting on patches, and our enthusiasm for them drained away.

    But if you're going to go through with this... refresh your memory about the reception of "No Man's Sky" and "Fallout 76". How many people demanded refunds, threatened lawsuits, years of infamy, stigma still keeping people from giving them a chance years later, etc. And be ready for a deluge of pressure for fixes to be churned out quickly enough for the audience's liking.

    With the "supporting wheels" off, you'll not only be expected not to wobble or crash, but to do wheelies and flips and crazy stunts. It's up to you if you feel ready, but a way less forgiving crowd will be the judges holding the scorecards.
     
    #60

Share This Page