Thanks Brimstone. I honestly wonder how we can bring the 85% and the 15% together. I don't advocate the forcing of anyone into pvp. Rather the opposite. That is why a proper and well designed economic market system would be ideal in the future.
I was creating a Scenario to work with Nastral's Config. I lost heart in v11 because of the shocking state of the gae on launch and only just returned
Sorry, but I don't see any other way to interpret this: as anything other than making PvE players risk PvP in order to obtain something not otherwise available. Please clarify if I'm missing something. On this point, you will have no argument from me- except that for PvP and PvE players to share an economy, they have to be playing on the same server. If they are playing on the same server, PvE players are restricted. PvP can travel wherever they want, PvE cannot. Ultimately, I think the bottom line is because the goals are so diametrically opposed, there really isn't much room for combined gameplay. Doesn't mean either side is inherently bad or wrong, it's just trying to mix oil and water I'd encourage you to pick back up on it. Don't think for a moment that Vermillion and Ravien haven't had the same frustrations
Thanks. The scenario I was building was a type of battle royale strictly for pvp'ers. It had resources that unlocked closer to the 'centre'. Each warp was one way, and also had a timer how long you were in a zone, therefor the the galaxy shrank and forced conflict. The other scenario was a RP PvPvE Scenario with factions that had strengths and weaknesses in the vessels that i designed for them. I might pick it up, I might wait a bit too.
More than that I would wish the range of the CV Multiturret would be doubled. In space it's just so annoying to have to reposition your CV the whole time!
Really, does this also work with Waypoints that you activated on a structure that you dismantled before you deactivated the Waypoint? If so please tell me how! Please!
Maximum range of the multiturret cannot exceed 150 because the particle effect of the beam fails to render if it's longer than 150m, resulting in an invisible beam. The multiturrets are actually meant to have an AoE effect, but the Radius function of the turret seems to have fallen out of use some time between A7 and A9. Open your map, click the Map Markers button (top right), select the Waypoint you want to remove and click the delete/trashcan button.
The 3 pillars of EGS are, Building, Surviving, Fighting The NPC don't offer a real fight, and Multiplayers has been part of EGS for (nearly ?) always soi put a doubt on that. Maybe it is so small, because it doesn't get enough attention from the devs for several Alphas? Well as there are less PvP players it results automatically in less PvP scenarios but there are a couple of Server that use their own PvP friendly scenarios. Last, i also believe in a compability of PvE and PvP and yes the toxicity between some players here is dangerous for that. (I am not on discord but seems tobe worse there?)
Start smaller, with gameplay tweaks ala Reforged Galaxy (heh.. like that's actually small) that suit the needs of PvPers, then move to a full-blown scenario I'd have never done my total conversion mod for Tribes 2 without starting off tweaking item stats in Baldur's Gate
I see 2 problems. and I'm just stating why observeation of this thread, and conclusion based on my experience from other threads and those 'mixed' servers I did play on. Lets start with the mixed servers: On each and every single server that has had PvP and PvE playfields equaly accessable, more sooner than later were ALL ores under AutoMiners gone, of course only in the PvE playfields. This 'forced' pvE players into pvP terretory, wether they liked or not. And for obvious reasons, PvP'ers were 'camping' near sathium.. all the time.. So every PvE player that tried got wasted... not by a 1 on 1, but by a 2 on 1.. So 2 PvP's were batteling 1 PvE ship. Yeah... great fun.. fair.. honorable... NOT! You talk about an ecomonic solution... How do you suppose that to look / work? An economy requires need/offer situations... Which ores are you willing to miss in order to NEED trading with PvE players? And keep in mind, people like me (PvE oriented) often start on extreme planets, like no air, no ores, no pois, no animals. And while I'm level 22, I managed to raise from hostile to unfriendly with most fractions, but I do not have enough Magnesium to do any (proper) raiding in order to get friendly with ANY faction -> So I could start trading. You are the 2nd PvP player (that I'm aware of) to come to the forums. You're just as civil, but I get the feeling that you have the expectation that we 'jump on board' just because of a civil discussion. The problem lies beyond that, as already stated, most of the PvP-related suggestions conterdicts with what PvE needs. However, some 'PvP-related' suggestions apply to PvE as well, such as ship-maneuver-ability. Or weapon targeting systems. Because I agree, in pure PvE situations, we cannot 'go to the fullest' compared to a player vs player fight. Then again, eversince A7 (when I started on a mixed server after 700 hrs singe player) PvP combats were either: 1) Done in like 2-10 seconds (surprise attack) 2) Take up to several hours I get it that people who seek such thrill may like this. However, PvE players usualy dont. Final note: You've dismissed several people in this thread, just scroll 'up'. They were civil and stated their mind, you want to express in freedom and not be 'hit', dont hit them for saying something you dont want to hear. (gives that impression) Equal rights for everyone! My 2 cents
But the standard range is not 150 meters is it? And if so maybe devs could extend that render range? Anyway your insights of the game are a profit for this forum. About the map markers: I know what you said but I was talking about activated waypoints! Those you can set in the registry on a structure, these are not visible in map menu. So once you destroyed that structure the only way to get rid of the waypoint is to reset all waypoints. Or am I missing another way @ravien_ff ?
There are several groups of PvP players - which pretty much reflect normally encounter human nature. In the real world people are self restrained because of consequences - being hunted by the police, captured/shot and thrown in jail for a long time tends to be a good deterrent. This is lacking on the internet so all those wannabe bullies, control freaks up to psychopathic serial killers, wanna be petty criminals and vandals are all mixed in with a smaller bunch of decent competitive PvP players in open public PvP. Then add that in games where there is most of your progression outside is just a perfect recipe for these kinds of people. Unlike your basic deathmatch/CTF etc old school PvP where everything is in the current session and thus everyone is even and thus skill based. Then finally we have admins too - some are great, some are just as bad as the players and do so because they want to play the players and not the game. Worse, some have their bunch of cronies who act as a bunch of thugs vs everyone else. For games like this the only PvP that really works for the few honourable players tends to be closed communities - closed clans with arranged fights, or arranged playthrough on a server etc where all start together and there is an end goal. These are the folks we can have reasonable discussion with. The rest however are the kind of garbage that should be rotting in some jail somewhere, or at the very least be on the receiving end of a permanent bans. Until you can clean up the PvP player base, then any discussion about bringing communities together is moot - they need to be cleaned up first. Even in games with no direct PvP, there are some (actually a lot from my experience of playing eco) who will still find a way to destroy the game for everyone else even if it just getting their jollies from dumping toxic waste all over the place to destroy farms, environment etc. In this game in an open PvE, then it would just be little things - locking and dumping vehicles in obstructive places for eg or anything else that is annoying to everyone else. They always find a way - its what they do, it is who they are. If someone can first find a way to clean up the pvp world, then great. Otherwise asking solo and co-op players to co-exist with a community that seems to include a very high proportion of deliberately disruptive individuals is a bit like asking normal people to move their homes into the gangland slums part of a city. Never going to happen. If you want PvP to work well in a game like this - it needs specific constrained universes with an end goal - ie suitable scenarios. Very likely the config values will have to be quite different to those in co-op/solo (because PvP does need some restrictions that are not needed for solo/co-op). The universe needs to be very different. The factions limited and preset and balanced in terms of number of players etc. Probably even the starts co-ordinated (hence closed communities of clans etc). I have seen good PvP done in space engineers based on these kind of approaches.
The Economist solution is quite easy. Let the RSS in pve replenish every day. Enlarge the distance between the PvP and PvE area (so it's not just one or two jumps but 5. At the same time Place a lot more RSS in PvP. It's no magic. I am on a Server where this works. We. Trade with the PvE guys, they give us stone and magnesium mostly and they get credits or zascosium and neodymium (somehow we have tons of that.)
Sorry but i want to intervenue here. I see several things wron in this post. @ravien_ff first just explained here why @Mars Volta gets a lot of negative vibes here. (The whole conversation is loaded with bad energy from other unfriendly experiences). At the same time disagreeing with another ones opionion vehemtly is not the same as dismissing someone. This is an opnion exchange at is not just okay but for a good outcome necessary to get different opinion. To make it constructive you have to explain why you disagree. That is how feedback works! So please let's take all a step back here. Let's forget the words that upset us, focus on beeing constructive and don't get offended by an opinion that doesn't match with your own. As a little help heres again a little guide on how feedback works: 1) State of your opinion (might be a bit like a summary) 2) explain why you have this opinion (its not enough to say "Yellow peppers in bolognese are better than red peppers." you need to add an explanation like: "the taste of yellow peppers add a more fresh taste to it as they have a generally fresher taste than the red one. additionally i like that they have an opposing colour to the red basis of the bolognese") 3) not always easy but it's best to add a proper solution (doesnt work well with my bolognese example but could be like ("Alternatively we could add zuccini to our bolognese. They don't add the more fresh taste but they add a nice colour as well") finally this might be the most important part here: 4) non violent communitcation (a friendly tone) When you start your comment with: "You post is stupid because ....." It doenst matter how good your reasoning behind the because might be you already insulted the other one and therefore it will be more difficult for him/her to focus on your reasons than on the insult. Instead you could go for formulations like: "I see your point but you forgot that ..." "I understand what you are saying but please consider ...." "That would work if ... but our situation seems to be ...."
I think there should always be PvE and PvP servers available (no one should be forced into PvP or PvE if they don't want it). But for those into multiplayer there are many benefits (IMHO) to mixed PvPvE servers that make them worth considering: Larger community rather two separate smaller communities Interesting PvE industry roles - selling ship parts to PvP factions, for example Improved economy - if you are only adding materials to the player universe, and rarely destroying them (I don't think I've ever lost a CV in PvE), you quickly hit server limits. PvP is a material sink that makes for an economy that doesn't "fill up" two weeks after a wipe (you can easily build any class 7 ship available in this time). People can easily transition between PvP or PvE roles without having to start from scratch, and they can dabble and learn from other players The two objections (afaik) are PvE players being forced to go into PvP space against their will, and toxicity between PvP and PvE players. I personally disagree with the first one. It's obviously possible to stay in PvE space, but this objection more specifically refers to all the resources running out in PvE space and being forced to go to PvP space for rare resources. I have never seen all the rares run outThis is a necessary part of a PvP or PvPvE server design - if there's no need to compete for resources there is no basis or meaning to warfare. By asking for rares to not be in PvP space, be clear you are asking for the removal of the economic basis for faction warfare. There is only a couple of servers with active PvP, so I think going into PvP space on those servers and then requesting that these be turned into a safe space (for example so you have same access to resources) is completely unreasonable to other players. The extra resources are in PvP in part to compensate for the big cost incurred by PvP players in frequently losing and repairing ships. On a PvE server, the extra resources wouldn't even be there because that would be a massive oversupply of resources when ship losses are ultra-rare, and it would break the economy. However, even if you are a PvE player on a PvP server, there is still some really good strategies available to get the rares, particularly trade! PvP factions need a large supply of common ores, and of course food, and so there is a lot of possibility to trade for them. You could also set up industry and supply completed parts. It's totally possible to get super rich and get loads of rares doing this, and never go into PvP space. Toxicity is a problem I agree. I see it in both PvErs and PvPers, and broadly think it should be addressed on an individual rather than group basis by empowering server managers/admins to deal with it.
Thia is pretty much the key. If you don't want to PvP, don't play on a PvP server. Likewise PvE, and more power to those who play mixed The negativity from PvE that I have seen, however, is usually in response to a demand for a game balance or setting to benefit PvP that has a negative impact on PvE, particularly solo or small CoOp play, or an expressed desire that PvP be forced across the board in general Both playstyles have specific needs, and given the majority of players are solo/CoOp, the default game balance needs to be set with that in mind. Specific changes needed by PvP need to be addressed in a scenario format so that every one can play the game as desired
Or vise versa. This is were i see the negativity coming from as well. I would prefer an EGS world were both (PVE and PvP) can be happy. And as i said, this is possible even if difficult and i am experiencing it. The described system is not perfect yet but i think it's a good step into the right direction. However i am not sure how to fit SP into this. But before someone puts wrong words into my posts again. I do not want SP to cut out of empyrion. It has value on it's own even if myself is not playing it anymore for years now.
That's actually the easiest part, or should be. Most players are SP, and that's really where the true balance needs to be set. CoOp needs (such as increased enemies/difficulty) should probably also be handled in scenario format, then PvP as another
